Paul Wade Posted February 25, 2022 Share Posted February 25, 2022 My fear is that Putin,seeing that his time table of conquests in his invasion of Ukraine not going according to plan,and the Ukrainian Army being a much stronger and well organised fighting machine that the Russians had previously thought,and with the world wide condemnation against this invasion,Putin will be backed into a corner and in order to save face and not lose this war,will resort to more extreme measures. He has already implied that he will use nuclear weapons if anyone tries to stop or interfere with his plans. These are frightening times. My prayers are with the Ukrainian people and I hope that democracy and level heads will ultimately prevail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest CzarnaWisnia Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 29 minutes ago, Paul Wade said: My fear is that Putin,seeing that his time table of conquests in his invasion of Ukraine not going according to plan,and the Ukrainian Army being a much stronger and well organised fighting machine that the Russians had previously thought,and with the world wide condemnation against this invasion,Putin will be backed into a corner and in order to save face and not lose this war,will resort to more extreme measures. He has already implied that he will use nuclear weapons if anyone tries to stop or interfere with his plans. These are frightening times. My prayers are with the Ukrainian people and I hope that democracy and level heads will ultimately prevail. I have no doubt he is ready to use nuclear weapons against Western countries if they act militarily. He is absolutely drunk with power and unpredictable. People generally have no idea how thin the thread of our normality hangs on (except now they kind of do with the covid catastrophe). Any one modern nuclear attack would be devastating, not only for the region struck but for others all over and for the environment (winds and water carry radioactivity). Russia has hundreds if not thousands of nuclear missiles at the ready. It's insane. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaudet Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 Think again if you believe this is just about Ukraine only. Russia threatens 'serious military repercussions' if Finland joins NATO Russia threatens 'military repercussions' if Finland joins NATO (yahoo.com) Russia warns of ‘military consequences’ if Finland and Sweden join Nato Russia warns of ‘military consequences’ if Finland and Sweden join Nato (telegraph.co.uk) Small man, HUGE ego. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaudet Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 'We have nukes' Putin issued chilling Nato warning by French Foreign Minister 'We have nukes' Putin issued chilling Nato warning by French Foreign Minister (msn.com) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaudet Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazzy Jan Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 22 minutes ago, Gaudet said: Think again if you believe this is just about Ukraine only. Russia threatens 'serious military repercussions' if Finland joins NATO Russia threatens 'military repercussions' if Finland joins NATO (yahoo.com) Russia warns of ‘military consequences’ if Finland and Sweden join Nato Russia warns of ‘military consequences’ if Finland and Sweden join Nato (telegraph.co.uk) Small man, HUGE ego. He is terrifying. How dare he dictate to Finland and Sweden about their choices . Putin is a dangerous loose canon who would not blink an eye about killing millions to regain absolute power and restore the USSR. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazzy Jan Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 The silence from China is deafening. If they back Putin, it would be an absolute disaster for the World. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaudet Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 Just now, Jazzy Jan said: The silence from China is deafening. If they back Putin, it would be an absolute disaster for the World. For the moment they did not vote in favor, they did abstain. However, as you indeed said, the consequence of China backing Russia would be a catastrophe for everyone, and I mean everyone in the world. Would that be convenient though to Russia and China destroying us all? If men ceased to see weapons as extensions of their penis therefore measure of antagonistic power, this damn planet would probably be a more harmonious place to co-exist all together. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest CzarnaWisnia Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 More analysis [disclaimer: I blame Russia for the illegal invasion of Ukraine and do not condone these actions] : Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Wade Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 The great tragedy of all this is that thousands of innocent Ukrainians will suffer because of Putin's huge ego and his longing to restore the Russian Empire. I keep hearing in the media that Putin is a great strategist,yet he seems oblivious to the fact that all of this won't end well for him and for Russia's reputation on the world stage. I also hear certain sections of the media saying that he is taking a leaf from Hitler's playbook of Dictatorship lunacy,it's hopefully only a matter of time before the Russian people rise up and run him out of office or before he is eventually either assassinated or arrested for War Crimes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest CzarnaWisnia Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 Oh no, how privileged and narcissistic of you. If only there was a way to turn off the news to preserve your poor fragile mind while people are getting killed. #WelcomeToNPR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazzy Jan Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 1 hour ago, Jazzy Jan said: The silence from China is deafening. If they back Putin, it would be an absolute disaster for the World. Quoting myself but have now seen China has commented. They had been very quiet previously. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazzy Jan Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 20 minutes ago, CzarnaWisnia said: Oh no, how privileged and narcissistic of you. If only there was a way to turn off the news to preserve your poor fragile mind while people are getting killed. #WelcomeToNPR Yes, I am also sick of the selfish self obsessed way that people are encouraged to worry about their personal reactions to a tragedy instead of the tragedy itself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest CzarnaWisnia Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 [disclaimer: I blame Russia for the illegal invasion of Ukraine and do not condone these actions] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lex92 Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 21 minutes ago, CzarnaWisnia said: Oh no, how privileged and narcissistic of you. If only there was a way to turn off the news to preserve your poor fragile mind while people are getting killed. #WelcomeToNPR Ridiculous Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 1 hour ago, CzarnaWisnia said: [disclaimer: I blame Russia for the illegal invasion of Ukraine and do not condone these actions] Yanis was my economics lecturer at first year uni. He was an average economist, and an ineffective finance minister. I guess he is entitled to his views, but this sounds like the worst approach. If Putin was really only concerned about NATO membership, he could have removed any reasons for nations wanting to join NATO. Instead he chose the opposite. It's clear that's not really his end game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazzy Jan Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 9 minutes ago, Paul said: Yanis was my economics lecturer at first year uni. He was an average economist, and an ineffective finance minister. I guess he is entitled to his views, but this sounds like the worst approach. If Putin was really only concerned about NATO membership, he could have removed any reasons for nations wanting to join NATO. Instead he chose the opposite. It's clear that's not really his end game. Agree. Also never give into blackmail. Dictators such as Putin blackmail and enter compromise agreements but ignore these agreements at their whim. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSD Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 17 minutes ago, Paul said: Yanis was my economics lecturer at first year uni. He was an average economist, and an ineffective finance minister. I guess he is entitled to his views, but this sounds like the worst approach. If Putin was really only concerned about NATO membership, he could have removed any reasons for nations wanting to join NATO. Instead he chose the opposite. It's clear that's not really his end game. If he was legitimately concerned with the "borders and buffers" narrative he wouldn't be threatening Sweden at this point and declaring that even Scandinavia has 0 sovereignty but whatever Russia deigns it to have. He's not really concerned much anymore with keeping up the whiny crybaby theatrics of the "victim of NATO" thing except with certain very small, very niche audiences (the RT viewership?), and buying into it at this point in the game feels more like an adherence to a prior ideology than anything else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toni Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 This is a great Twitter feed to follow. Give this tweet a retweet! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dollhouse Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 8 hours ago, lex92 said: At this point it makes no sense to analyze the historic events that lead Putin to invade a souvereign democrazy in europe. At the very moment there is people fighting for their human rights. So what they need is our emphathy and moral support as all that is happening right now. Historians will analyze all that afterwards anyway. They are fighting for all Europeans security, alone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
air1975 Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 5 hours ago, Jazzy Jan said: I watched an interesting interview yesterday with our former foreign affairs minister Julie Bishop. She met Putin at a conference and discussed the shooting down of the passenger plane by Russia that killed all civilian passengers. She said Putin was steely, hard, unapologetic, determined and spoke perfect English in person. Also said he was passionate about wanting the USSR to return to it’s glory and thought it’s dismantling was the biggest travesty of the last century. Extremely dangerous times ahead in Europe. That is very frightening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
air1975 Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 4 hours ago, Gaudet said: Think again if you believe this is just about Ukraine only. Russia threatens 'serious military repercussions' if Finland joins NATO So true. Not about just Ukraine. What a fucking tragedy. And seems so avoidable and unnecessary as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elijah Posted February 26, 2022 Author Share Posted February 26, 2022 Poland 1939 Finland 1939 Lithuania Latvia Estonia 1940 Bulgaria 1944 Hungary 1956 Chehoslovakia 1968 Afganistan 1979 Moldova 1993 Georgia 2008 Ukraine 2014 Armenia 2021 Belarus 2021 Kazahstan 2021 Ukraine 2022 on top off my head - to make the thread more "balanced" with the list Nessie posted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elijah Posted February 26, 2022 Author Share Posted February 26, 2022 Taken from FB: "Now another "apologetic" argument - why shouldn't Putin invade Ukraine, when the United States bombed Serbia? First, in Yugoslavia, like the USSR, there was a movement for self-determination of the former republics - and so Slovenia, Croatia and Macedonia, and Ukraine from the USSR became independent states, and in the first two cases Milosevic like Putin - 30 years late - asked with force to stop them. Second, there was the genocide of Milosevic against the population of Kosovo, which, like Putin for Ukraine, Milosevic saw as the cradle of Serbian statehood and wanted to drive Albanians away from him. There are no reports of Ukrainian atrocities against Russians, except in isolated cases that are not state policy to provoke an interstate war. Thirdly, Milosevic had already violated many UN resolutions and the charter, which provoked an international reaction. There is no information that Ukraine has violated international law. Fourth, to stop the bloodshed, NATO intervened, not just the United States, after Serbia refused to fulfill the agreements reached for the withdrawal of the army from Kosovo, even with the mediation of Russian Prime Minister Chernomyrdin! What agreements has Ukraine not fulfilled? Fifth, because of ethnic cleansing - which is considered a crime against humanity, the UN with Resolution 1244, adopted by 14 votes in favor and one abstention (China) allows an armed presence under the auspices of the UN and its administration governs Kosovo." Again to balance out this thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilt Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 Please read this article through Google Translate. https://www.currenttime.tv/a/eto-ne-lichnaya-psihopatiya-putina-eto-fsb-reshilo-realizovat-ideyu-deglobalizirovannoy-rossii-versiya-o-realnoy-prichine-voyny-s-ukrainoy/31723390.html From the military point of view, officially declared, some kind of "denazification" is madness. And I really want to explain this by the personal psychopathy of Vladimir Putin. But I have a feeling that this is not Vladimir Putin's personal psychopathy, because all his words about "Nazis" are the words of any colonel, major of the FSB in any regional department. I am more than sure that, in general, we are dealing with a domestic political situation, when the FSB is not just trying to participate in an ideological discussion, but has taken action. Because FSB officers, the current and former ones, are not only abstractly present in power in Russia. They are in the General Staff and in corporations. And, in general, they, as I understand it, decided to implement their idea of a deglobalized Russia. The idea that it's time to finish with all these games of the last 30 years and that we need to press the entire post-Soviet space to the nail and, in general, clog up and survive on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karbatal Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 8 hours ago, Jazzy Jan said: I watched an interesting interview yesterday with our former foreign affairs minister Julie Bishop. She met Putin at a conference and discussed the shooting down of the passenger plane by Russia that killed all civilian passengers. She said Putin was steely, hard, unapologetic, determined and spoke perfect English in person. Also said he was passionate about wanting the USSR to return to it’s glory and thought it’s dismantling was the biggest travesty of the last century. Extremely dangerous times ahead in Europe. Most all people who have met him say he is not mentally healthy. He is incredibly dangerous. I do hope that those surrounding him do something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karbatal Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 7 hours ago, Jazzy Jan said: The silence from China is deafening. If they back Putin, it would be an absolute disaster for the World. yesterday China has asked Putin to stop and negociate. That was the only good news of the day. EDIT: I just saw your next post Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karbatal Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 22 minutes ago, Kilt said: Please read this article through Google Translate. https://www.currenttime.tv/a/eto-ne-lichnaya-psihopatiya-putina-eto-fsb-reshilo-realizovat-ideyu-deglobalizirovannoy-rossii-versiya-o-realnoy-prichine-voyny-s-ukrainoy/31723390.html From the military point of view, officially declared, some kind of "denazification" is madness. And I really want to explain this by the personal psychopathy of Vladimir Putin. But I have a feeling that this is not Vladimir Putin's personal psychopathy, because all his words about "Nazis" are the words of any colonel, major of the FSB in any regional department. I am more than sure that, in general, we are dealing with a domestic political situation, when the FSB is not just trying to participate in an ideological discussion, but has taken action. Because FSB officers, the current and former ones, are not only abstractly present in power in Russia. They are in the General Staff and in corporations. And, in general, they, as I understand it, decided to implement their idea of a deglobalized Russia. The idea that it's time to finish with all these games of the last 30 years and that we need to press the entire post-Soviet space to the nail and, in general, clog up and survive on. They should do that without interfering in other countries. What a bunch of psychos Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karbatal Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 1 hour ago, elijah said: Taken from FB: "Now another "apologetic" argument - why shouldn't Putin invade Ukraine, when the United States bombed Serbia? First, in Yugoslavia, like the USSR, there was a movement for self-determination of the former republics - and so Slovenia, Croatia and Macedonia, and Ukraine from the USSR became independent states, and in the first two cases Milosevic like Putin - 30 years late - asked with force to stop them. Second, there was the genocide of Milosevic against the population of Kosovo, which, like Putin for Ukraine, Milosevic saw as the cradle of Serbian statehood and wanted to drive Albanians away from him. There are no reports of Ukrainian atrocities against Russians, except in isolated cases that are not state policy to provoke an interstate war. Thirdly, Milosevic had already violated many UN resolutions and the charter, which provoked an international reaction. There is no information that Ukraine has violated international law. Fourth, to stop the bloodshed, NATO intervened, not just the United States, after Serbia refused to fulfill the agreements reached for the withdrawal of the army from Kosovo, even with the mediation of Russian Prime Minister Chernomyrdin! What agreements has Ukraine not fulfilled? Fifth, because of ethnic cleansing - which is considered a crime against humanity, the UN with Resolution 1244, adopted by 14 votes in favor and one abstention (China) allows an armed presence under the auspices of the UN and its administration governs Kosovo." Again to balance out this thread. Well written. Now look at the history of the invented country of Panama. Or the Iran Contra scandal. Or Chile. Just in case you want to balance more things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Camacho Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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