Israel and Hamas war

[MadFan]

On 10/10/2023 at 1:27 PM, debord said:

The decapitated babies story came from a single source, which is discredited. The IDF has even said it has no evidence of it. Suggesting it's true because Hamas killed people is absolutely ridiculous.

There's been an update since this post, with Israel's government posting photos of burned and beheaded babies (purportedly by Hamas) about 4 hours ago. Of course it's political machination at work but it feels important to update since this has taken over so much of the discourse.

 

[debord]

9 minutes ago, MadFan said:

There's been an update since this post, with Israel's government posting photos of burned and beheaded babies (purportedly by Hamas) about 4 hours ago. Of course it's political machination at work but it feels important to update since this has taken over so much of the discourse.

 

I think it's important to acknowledge that the claim went from '40 decapitated babies' to 'they killed babies'.  And given we had that former story going all over the world within hours, then journalist after journalist saying they hadn't seen it and couldn't verify, then the IDF saying they couldn't verify, then the IDF saying they wouldn't verify out of respect, then some horrific photos which don't show what was claimed...you can understand the response.

There is no doubt that children will have been killed in the Hamas attack. Many, many more children are being killed in Gaza as we speak. What ultimately matters is that the occupation ends and the cycle of violence is broken.

[MadFan]

2 minutes ago, debord said:

I think it's important to acknowledge that the claim went from '40 decapitated babies' to 'they killed babies'.  And given we had that former story going all over the world within hours, then journalist after journalist saying they hadn't seen it and couldn't verify, then the IDF saying they couldn't verify, then the IDF saying they wouldn't verify out of respect, then some horrific photos which don't show what was claimed...you can understand the response.

There is no doubt that children will have been killed in the Hamas attack. Many, many more children are being killed in Gaza as we speak. What ultimately matters is that the occupation ends and the cycle of violence is broken.

Completely agreed. Ultimately loss of life is what matters and the burned/beheaded claims are being used to manufacture consent and exploit the stereotype of Middle Eastern people as barbaric and primal... it's sad, predictable, and of course doesn't take away from the fact that those actions are indeed barbaric and primal (and equally so when babies in Gaza are killed).

[GOD]

9 hours ago, Acediace said:

And here again, my point. You are so quick to question the integrity of stories that you see about action done by hamas on Israelis, but you are so quick to belive a complete illogical story like that.

In no way Palestinian asks Israel permission to enter areas with ambulances to take care of injured people. Do you really think that Palestinian will ask anything from Israel right now? That there is any communication between Israel and Gaza? Yeah? No, there is zero communication between them

If israel wants to bomb an ambulances and medical worker, they can just bomb rhe hospitals or medical center without pulling tricks

Dude, you are the one posting fake stories, and accusing others of the same? LOL Stop acting like your government. 

[GOD]

7 hours ago, Camacho said:

 

thats disgusting, those are the real animals and heartless barbarians. 

[Kilt]

It seems foolish not to expect Israel to retaliate. And Hamas knew very well the kind of response they'd get from Israel as consequence for their attacks, including the death of innocent civilians. There's no winner here.

[whyme?]

1 hour ago, GOD said:

thats disgusting, those are the real animals and heartless barbarians. 

This is exactly what antisemites and bigots do. They post some stupid shit that a stupid moron did, and attribute it to an entire people. This is pure propaganda that they used to do for centuries against Jews. (And it’s done against other minorities too). There are tons of videos from the other side out there that show disgusting mockeries against Jewish people too. But what’s the point of posting those? So we can all hate Muslims and Palestinians? It just creates more hate. This shit was done all year between Russians and Ukrainians. I can’t believe I’m seeing this hatred and propaganda on a Madonna forum. 

[GOD]

1 minute ago, whyme? said:

This is exactly what antisemites and bigots do. They post some stupid shit that a stupid moron did, and attribute it to an entire people. This is pure propaganda that they used to do for centuries against Jews. (And it’s done against other minorities too). There are tons of videos out there that show disgusting mockeries against Jewish people too. But what’s the point of posting those? So we can all hate Muslims and Palestinians? It just creates more hate. This shit was done all year between Russians and Ukrainians. I can’t believe I’m seeing this hatred and propaganda on a Madonna forum. 

You’re saying the person in that video is not Israeli ? 

[MadFan]

 

A million people in 24 hours? This is going to get horrific. Ground invasion is imminent.

[karbatal]

1 hour ago, whyme? said:

This is exactly what antisemites and bigots do. They post some stupid shit that a stupid moron did, and attribute it to an entire people. This is pure propaganda that they used to do for centuries against Jews. (And it’s done against other minorities too). There are tons of videos from the other side out there that show disgusting mockeries against Jewish people too. But what’s the point of posting those? So we can all hate Muslims and Palestinians? It just creates more hate. This shit was done all year between Russians and Ukrainians. I can’t believe I’m seeing this hatred and propaganda on a Madonna forum. 

It’s funny that nobody says that we hate orthodox people when we say Putin is a cunt. Saying Hamas are evil and the Israel response is a war crime has nothing to do with religion in my mind.

[karbatal]

1 minute ago, MadFan said:

 

A million people in 24 hours? This is going to get horrific. Ground invasion is imminent.

If this world was fair those people giving orders in Israel would be on the trials for war crimes.

[karbatal]

Oh and speaking of Putin. When Russia does it, it’s “war crimes” and “pure terror”. When Israel does it, it’s crickets. Let’s remember these words from president of the EU Commission 

 

[debord]

2 hours ago, whyme? said:

This is exactly what antisemites and bigots do. They post some stupid shit that a stupid moron did, and attribute it to an entire people. This is pure propaganda that they used to do for centuries against Jews. (And it’s done against other minorities too). There are tons of videos from the other side out there that show disgusting mockeries against Jewish people too. But what’s the point of posting those? So we can all hate Muslims and Palestinians? It just creates more hate. This shit was done all year between Russians and Ukrainians. I can’t believe I’m seeing this hatred and propaganda on a Madonna forum. 

I trust you'll be vocally angry at the people and politicians, in Israel and around the world, who keep conflating Israel with all Jewish people when expressing support, right?

[karbatal]

Time to include the Israelí government in the list of terrorist groups. Please remember this when Lebanon’s Hezbollah commits a terrorist attack.

 

[GOD]

2 hours ago, Kilt said:

It seems foolish not to expect Israel to retaliate. And Hamas knew very well the kind of response they'd get from Israel as consequence for their attacks, including the death of innocent civilians. There's no winner here.

It’s one thing to retaliate and another to mow the lawn. They are aiming to wipe them out. 

[GOD]

12 minutes ago, karbatal said:

Time to include the Israelí government in the list of terrorist groups. Please remember this when Lebanon’s Hezbollah commits a terrorist attack.

 

They are attacking Lebanon now too? 

[promise to try]

is lebanon´s government helping Hamas?

[Kilt]

15 minutes ago, GOD said:

It’s one thing to retaliate and another to mow the lawn. They are aiming to wipe them out. 

Hamas should have known better either way. Since they are waging the wholy war, then in theory, they should have expected a wipe out. If not, then they are not so forward looking.

[Kilt]

10 minutes ago, promise to try said:

is lebanon´s government helping Hamas?

Hamas launched the missiles from Northern Lebanon, i think?

[GOD]

32 minutes ago, Kilt said:

Hamas should have known better either way. Since they are waging the wholy war, then in theory, they should have expected a wipe out. If not, then they are not so forward looking.

Israel is the one that waged this wholy war from 60 years ago 
 

[GOD]

32 minutes ago, Kilt said:

Hamas launched the missiles from Northern Lebanon, i think?

I also heard they attacked Syria? 

[karbatal]

1 hour ago, Kilt said:

Hamas should have known better either way. Since they are waging the wholy war, then in theory, they should have expected a wipe out. If not, then they are not so forward looking.

No civilians are responsible of the acts of terrorist groups. Not even government acts. Those are considered war crimes by international law.

[Kilt]

14 minutes ago, karbatal said:

No civilians are responsible of the acts of terrorist groups. Not even government acts. Those are considered war crimes by international law.

I agree with you

[Acediace]

4 hours ago, karbatal said:

Time to include the Israelí government in the list of terrorist groups. Please remember this when Lebanon’s Hezbollah commits a terrorist attack.

 

Hezbulla and hamas has already attack Israel from the north. "Please remember it when they attack"???

muckinwhyanxufjkfifkdkwbdjjfjdhshhxjdhshjdjfngnfhdjsukendhdh 

What the fuckkk

What 

Thhheee

Fuck

Hezbulla===Hamas===al queada===Isis

They literally keep on firing rocket to the north of Israel since around the begging of the week. 

 

I can't even express how stupid you all look making statements on things that you have zero *zero* ZERO  knowledge on.

God

You know what. It is what it is. I really should stop enter here

[debord]

28 minutes ago, Acediace said:

Hezbulla and hamas has already attack Israel from the north. "Please remember it when they attack"???

muckinwhyanxufjkfifkdkwbdjjfjdhshhxjdhshjdjfngnfhdjsukendhdh 

What the fuckkk

What 

Thhheee

Fuck

Hezbulla===Hamas===al queada===Isis

They literally keep on firing rocket to the north of Israel since around the begging of the week. 

 

I can't even express how stupid you all look making statements on things that you have zero *zero* ZERO  knowledge on.

God

You know what. It is what it is. I really should stop enter here

Attacking folk for ignorance when you write something as inane as "Hezbulla===Hamas===al queada===Isis" is quite something. For a start, Hezbollah is a Shia org while Hamas is Sunni. If you know anything at all, you'll know this is a fundamental divide which has caused much conflict - but their common cause is opposing Israeli occupation. You'll also note that credible orgs are now confirming Israel is using chemical weapons, which you were vehemently denying.

[karbatal]

1 hour ago, Acediace said:

Hezbulla and hamas has already attack Israel from the north. "Please remember it when they attack"???

muckinwhyanxufjkfifkdkwbdjjfjdhshhxjdhshjdjfngnfhdjsukendhdh 

What the fuckkk

What 

Thhheee

Fuck

Hezbulla===Hamas===al queada===Isis

They literally keep on firing rocket to the north of Israel since around the begging of the week. 

 

I can't even express how stupid you all look making statements on things that you have zero *zero* ZERO  knowledge on.

God

You know what. It is what it is. I really should stop enter here

You should focus your energy into hoping that your government stops behaving like a terrorist group.

[Acediace]

1 hour ago, debord said:

Attacking folk for ignorance when you write something as inane as "Hezbulla===Hamas===al queada===Isis" is quite something. For a start, Hezbollah is a Shia org while Hamas is Sunni. If you know anything at all, you'll know this is a fundamental divide which has caused much conflict - but their common cause is opposing Israeli occupation. You'll also note that credible orgs are now confirming Israel is using chemical weapons, which you were vehemently denying.

I know that these are different terror organizations

They goal is not opposing Israel occupation  their goals is to kill and I think it's very obvious after recent events, for those who were (are) in a bubble and think these organization have real values and real goals other than terror for all. Hamas knew exactly what butchering and kidnapping 1000++++ and counting Israelis will lead to. They didn't do this to start debating peace.

 

29 minutes ago, karbatal said:

You should focus your energy into hoping that your government stops behaving like a terrorist group.

Yeah you right my focus right now should be on other stuff..  like hiding in shelter from rockets or check out with people that I know who were hidden for 30+ hours in shelter while hearing terrorist outside and just got lucky they decided not to enter their house, and when the army got them out, all they sew is dead bodies everywhere. Yeah I should really check on them.

 

"Yeah but you keep ignoring the actions of tour government  who keeps on killing Palestinian"

I'm not. You really have no idea what my political opinions are and you totally missed my point here. 

[ULIZOS]

35 minutes ago, Acediace said:

I know that these are different terror organizations

They goal is not opposing Israel occupation  their goals is to kill and I think it's very obvious after recent events, for those who were (are) in a bubble and think these organization have real values and real goals other than terror for all. Hamas knew exactly what butchering and kidnapping 1000++++ and counting Israelis will lead to. They didn't do this to start debating peace.

 

 

OMFG nobody here supports Hamas. They’re fucking trash monsters. Every single person in this thread agrees. Move on. 

[whyme?]

1 hour ago, karbatal said:

You should focus your energy into hoping that your government stops behaving like a terrorist group.

The focus should be liberating the Palestinians in Gaza from this insane, murderous fundamentalist Hamas and Islamic Jihad. I can’t believe you don’t want that for them. They suffered over 15 years from their sick control, and war after war with Israel. It’s beyond me how fellow Madonna fans who are supposed to be liberal loving people, would support this shit. I think it’s pure hatred against the Jews. 
The only way to solve this problem is to ensure the security of Israel 100% and have a two state solution. Two countries, side by side. Jordan and Egypt have made peace with Israel, Palestinians should be next. And definitely Lebanon! And hopefully Syria one day, but who knows..

[debord]

1 minute ago, whyme? said:

The focus should be liberating the Palestinians in Gaza from this insane, murderous fundamentalist Hamas and Islamic Jihad. I can’t believe you don’t want that for them. They suffered over 15 years from their sick control, and war after war with Israel. It’s beyond me how fellow Madonna fans who are supposed to be liberal loving people, would support this shit. I think it’s pure hatred against the Jews. 
The only way to solve this problem is to ensure the security of Israel 100% and have a two state solution. Two countries, side by side. Jordan and Egypt have made peace with Israel, Palestinians should be next. And definitely Lebanon! And hopefully Syria one day, but who knows..

Perhaps the fact that when Palestinians try peaceful protest, they get murdered, when they try peaceful boycotts, they get criminalised and banned, and when they support more peaceful orgs Israel boosts orgs like Hamas to undermine them has already been pointed out several times. Yet we keep getting this "Hamas are evil and are stopping peace" line from folk who refuse to engage with history.