MForever Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 (edited) What's the problem with the "sold outs"??? It's a relative concept that depends on the size of the venue and the expected attendance. If they say that a show is sold out, it means that they have met their expectations, that's all. That doesn't mean that the stadium has to be packed. I also think that the term "sold out" is good for promotion but doesn't indicate anything, it's like saying that your album is #1: looks good on paper, but if the following week you are out of the top 40, it's a disaster. As long as the attendance and the revenues are healthy, I don't see a problem. It's normal. It's her fifth tour in 12 years and she has saturated the european market. Selling big stadiums at top prices cannot last forever. It's normal to find some empty sections here and there. And I'm sure they still prefer stadiums with some empty sections than packed arenas. Edited August 30, 2012 by MForever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XXL Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 I'm not talking about the revenue, I'm just saying the way the amount of tickets that were sold r being reported as sold out is 'manipulated'. It's not a big deal, but I don't see why people should get so upset over it when someone wants 2 point that out. Such cultlike behaviour. I love the bitch & went 2 many shows, why on earth would I wanna c her fail? Honey I have absolutely no doubt about that but when you say that MDNA in Europe had a less stellar turn out than Sticky's European leg it just ain't true as it's not supported by photographic evidence, figures or any official data. The way you imply manipulation then suggests it might have happened with S&S too or with any other artist since the only official info available on these things come from Billboard and the concerned artist's tour promoter. That goes for everyone. Your theory of manipulation just doesn't hold Let's say 45,000 tickets were put on sale for the Brussell gig for instance and OF THAT 28 tickets priced at $3,000 hadn't been sold would you say the gig wasn't a sell-out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drunkbysix Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 its not bout being negative its bout reality, so eat it bitch anyway, ya i'm happy with the tour cuz its the best thing she has ever done live - i just wish she would want to top herself because that is really her true competition.....she doesnt feel the need to, fine. this tour still rocks the socks off sticky and sweet ANYDAY (i hate that tour) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XXL Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 Someone mentioned that the media reported attendance of 70 000 in Kiev. This could actually be true. Live Nation had to provide figures to Billboard before a single ticket went on sale - they had to report how many tickets they expected to sell at each venue. In Kiev, they expected to sell 33 000 or whatever it was. The figure reported by the media would have come from the venue itself, since they know how many people went through the gates. Live Nation, though, can only report to Billboard how many tickets were sold based on the reported estimate they provided. Any sales above that figure go unreported - this is the way the industry works. In reality, there were probably 70 000 people at the show in Kiev, but Live Nation grossly underestimated how many tickets they would be able to sell. They still pocket the money, but they can't report the revenue or the attendance numbers above the 31 000 they had projected. Thank God for someone divulging accurate info and not personal opinion. Take the figure from Nice where she peformed in 2008 as well and in the same venue too. Madonna, LMFAO MDNA Stade Charles-Ehrmann Nice, France Aug. 21, 2012 $2,386,311 29,670 / 29,670 1 / 1 $186.24, $55.87 Live Nation Global Touring/Live Nation France Madonna, Robyn S&S Stade Charles-Ehrmann - Nice, France - Aug. 26, 2008 Gross Sales: $4,381,242 Attend/Capacity: 41,483 / 41,483 Shows/Sellouts: 1 / 1 Prices: $249.09, $80.59 How is it possible a difference of 12,000 in attendance when there's photographic evidence (and I saw it with my eyes too, GU can confirm) that there wasn't an empty single spot in sight just as much as there wasn't in 2008. 12,000 tickets must be missing....... Or maybe it works as Carta says: LN sets up an expected figure before any single ticket is actually put on sale and the sold out is declared based on that figure regardless of the fact that the venue is having more people in it on the day of the concert, which means that these dates ARE ALL sell-outs NICE 2012 (and so were the stands on all sides) she can't have sold 12,000 tickets less than 2008 Not a single extra person could have fit in that stadium last week Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
realityisalways Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 So what's the haters' point? Yeah she is performing to half empty venues Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kim Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 Acko's correct obviously. The old-school term "sold out" used to mean a venue was packed to capacity and you could not secure a ticket no matter what because they were, er....sold out. Now it means if attendance goes above whatever random figure the promotor CONSIDERS sold out, say 30,000 (for a gig in a 65.000 seater stadium) then they'll report it as sold out. If the actual figure goes ABOVE that estimation then they'll report the actual figure. They didn't for example predict to Billboard in advance that Edinburgh would sell 52,160. That is the actual attendance figure of that show. They probably had a really conservative figure of 30,000 or so in mind which is why Dublin, in a similar sized stadium but with 20,000 less people was also considered sold out I've no interest in posting the embarrassing pictures of Sweden and Dublin where the stadium floor is barely half full. But those 25,000-30,000 people milling around in those 70,000 seater stadiums are not at an actual sold out gig. Yes it's all semantics and silly posturing by promoters but that's what the touring business is all about. In Madonna's case they hire these huge soccer stadiums, airport hangars and barren fields and simple fill them up as best they can keeping a nice safe "sold out" estimate. And no this isn't about HATERZZZ undermining Madonna's fantastic touring achievements, she's doing wonderfully, just playing mostly unsuitable venues outside the US. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XXL Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 I'm not talking about the revenue, I'm just saying the way the amount of tickets that were sold r being reported as sold out is 'manipulated'. It's not a big deal, but I don't see why people should get so upset over it when someone wants 2 point that out. Such cultlike behaviour. I love the bitch & went 2 many shows, why on earth would I wanna c her fail? By Billboard Boxscore figures one means all the figures: revenue, attendance, sell-out or not etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nikki Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 I think the "empty blocks" in brussels got to do with the media trashing Madonna after SS and still going on about it three years later, with the day of the start of the sale of the MDNA tour here, where they focused on the "ridiculous high prices". a week later they went on about it "only selling half of the tickets yet" and making ridiculous comparisons with gaga selling out her first date in an ARENA (yet they're still suspiciously quiet about lg not being able to sell her second date in antwerp, in total she sold way less than madonna in brussels. but who cares about that? right?) - Had the media been more fair she would have sold out brussels, imo. But it seems like they've been on a "lets all hate madonna" mindset for the last three and a half years now. (well, except for one red channel the last month due to madonna's anti marine le pen vid & pussy riot support. ) btw, acko: you can bet that the belgians will make a huge deal out of her boxscore/ticket sales when they're released at the end of the tour (probably making it out as if every date of her tour thats marked as "sold out" really isnt sold out- even though some dates ARE in fact sold out, but you know how they are;)) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XXL Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 In reality, there were probably 70 000 people at the show in Kiev, but Live Nation grossly underestimated how many tickets they would be able to sell. They still pocket the money, but they can't report the revenue or the attendance numbers above the 31 000 they had projected. This is what I mean, thank you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XXL Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 I think the "empty blocks" in brussels got to do with the media trashing Madonna after SS and still going on about it three years later, with the day of the start of the sale of the MDNA tour here, where they focused on the "ridiculous high prices". a week later they went on about it "only selling half of the tickets yet" and making ridiculous comparisons with gaga selling out her first date in an ARENA (yet they're still suspiciously quiet about lg not being able to sell her second date in antwerp, in total she sold way less than madonna in brussels. but who cares about that? right?) - Had the media been more fair she would have sold out brussels, imo. But it seems like they've been on a "lets all hate madonna" mindset for the last three and a half years now. (well, except for one red channel the last month due to madonna's anti marine le pen vid & pussy riot support. ) btw, acko: you can bet that the belgians will make a huge deal out of her boxscore/ticket sales when they're released at the end of the tour (probably making it out as if every date of her tour thats marked as "sold out" really isnt sold out- even though some dates ARE in fact sold out, but you know how they are;)) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nikki Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 lol its true though, the way they've been so anti M and pro LG was getting a bit too obvious Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kim Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 Well going by the above logic, obviously gaga DID actually sell out that second date....but the silly promotor underestimated the attendance and reported the wrong figure to Billboard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drunkbysix Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 Acko's correct obviously. The old-school term "sold out" used to mean a venue was packed to capacity and you could not secure a ticket no matter what because they were, er....sold out. Now it means if attendance goes above whatever random figure the promotor CONSIDERS sold out, say 30,000 (for a gig in a 65.000 seater stadium) then they'll report it as sold out. If the actual figure goes ABOVE that estimation then they'll report the actual figure. They didn't for example predict to Billboard in advance that Edinburgh would sell 52,160. That is the actual attendance figure of that show. They probably had a really conservative figure of 30,000 or so in mind which is why Dublin, in a similar sized stadium but with 20,000 less people was also considered sold out I've no interest in posting the embarrassing pictures of Sweden and Dublin where the stadium floor is barely half full. But those 25,000-30,000 people milling around in those 70,000 seater stadiums are not at an actual sold out gig. Yes it's all semantics and silly posturing by promoters but that's what the touring business is all about. In Madonna's case they hire these huge soccer stadiums, airport hangars and barren fields and simple fill them up as best they can keeping a nice safe "sold out" estimate. And no this isn't about HATERZZZ undermining Madonna's fantastic touring achievements, she's doing wonderfully, just playing mostly unsuitable venues outside the US. oh do bother. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kim Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 oh do bother. oh..... ok do..... ok bother..... ok oh, do, bother. Ohdo BOTHER. Oh DO bother. Ohdobother. Nope. Give up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magom Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 It's so exhausting to read all this BS. She's doing grea no matter TCT / S&S / MDNA anybody else fav could never Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pedrohdi Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 It's so exhausting to read all this BS. She's doing grea no matter TCT / S&S / MDNA anybody else fav could never Right on!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
realityisalways Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 oh..... ok do..... ok bother..... ok oh, do, bother. Ohdo BOTHER. Oh DO bother. Ohdobother. Nope. Give up. The meltdown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kim Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 The meltdown Er, hardly. I was demonstrating that what she said made absolutely no sense, gramatical or otherwise. Strange that all your posts have the dreaded whiff of RETARD about them but oh well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genevieve Vavance Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 haterzzzz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tuckeye Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 were all just angelina jolie in girl, interrupted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtzlplk Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 can't we just let it be, that when it is reported to be SOLD OUT that it indeed SELL OUT? Do we really know any better? Why make simple things complicated? We never complain about other's "SOLD OUT" reports right? So why complain about MADONNA's? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starman Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 A lot of the difference has to to with the stage set-up that for the MDNA tour , they have to use the middle of the field coz the stage + the screens are too big for a normal concert setup Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Probed By Greys Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 name='XXL' timestamp='1346285220' post='1339473'][/b]Rihanna is not even half her age and she's taking in 2/3 of MDNA's revenue so far with three times as many dates ..... Why even bring her up? Some of her tours lost money. She's no where near M. M is just competing with herself here. If Gaga manages to top M, it would only be because she toured for years nonstop. And, it would be temporary, like when Cher briefly took M's touring record away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Case39 Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 Why even bring her up? Some of her tours lost money. She's no where near M. M is just competing with herself here. If Gaga manages to top M, it would only be because she toured for years nonstop. And, it would be temporary, like when Cher briefly took M's touring record away. THIS. We all know that if Madonna did 200+ dates like Gaga did, she would have the highest grossing tour of all time. And that will probably happen at some point, it would be amazing for her to have a Farewell Tour. Maybe for her last tour ever? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
datf Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 the north american leg of the tour wouldn't gross a lot more than $111 million. i remember some time ago, live nation announced that ~683000 tickets have been sold with only about 30000 tickets left. thus i don't expect the north american gross to be over $115 million. all in all, the tour will probably gross a total of $280 million. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XXL Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 Why even bring her up? Some of her tours lost money. She's no where near M. M is just competing with herself here. If Gaga manages to top M, it would only be because she toured for years nonstop. And, it would be temporary, like when Cher briefly took M's touring record away. I agree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drunkbysix Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 oh..... ok do..... ok bother..... ok oh, do, bother. Ohdo BOTHER. Oh DO bother. Ohdobother. Nope. Give up. what the hell are you taking about? oh do bother is grammatically correct if you read what you posted. "I wont bother" "oh, DO bother" ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kim Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 what the hell are you taking about? oh do bother is grammatically correct if you read what you posted. "I wont bother" "oh, DO bother" ?? If YOU read what I posted, you'd see that nowhere in my post did I say "I wont bother". Therefore your response was completely nonsensical and moronic....funnily enough.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drunkbysix Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 If YOU read what I posted, you'd see that nowhere in my post did I say "I wont bother". Therefore your response was completely nonsensical and moronic....funnily enough.. Fine, you said you had no interest to post the pictures it could quite possibly mean the same thing. if you have no interest in doing something, you wont bother doing it right? who cares anyway? it's not like the sentence wasnt english. this has nothing to do with my grammar anyway, so you're the one who looks stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kim Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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