EUROVISION! The aftermath!

[Martin B.]

39 minutes ago, karbatal said:

Is this meltdown the biggest ever in Mafonnanation history? 

Prince’s tribute says hi!

[Vogue992]

Btw i've just re-watched the performance and i appreciated it even more. LOVE those strong visuals and I'm one of those fans who loves Future. Yes, a few off key notes, but she had the balls to sing LAP basically acapella. Anyone else would have been praised for a performance like that. The amount of hate she's getting is just too much.

I'm very proud of Madonna.

[dumitru]

Name any 1998 with live singing for me was worse. To me the entire Rol persona felt dull and fake. Thit time she was invested. Today i watched it again, amd again, and again. Still loving it. The new material rocks. Hwo else would ve performed an album track at such an event ? I can not wait june 7th to hear the entire Dark Ballet

[rebelgirl]

1 minute ago, runa said:

or ROL MTV Awards 1998

it's true ... but in those days there were no social networks, internet, haters ..

the media still had some credibility.. the media write trash, that do not even bother to confirm.

 

[Guest Amelia aka Neutrocks]

9 minutes ago, lautert said:

Of course I'm taking in charge these elements, but even so, there were stairs at the super bowl as well. She has done a lot of difficult things. If the stairs and the eyepatch is the reason for her being static, which I doubt, then remove it from the performance. 

And I'm not hating on her, I still enjoy the performance, but it's undeniable that she is slowing down a lot her performances, which make me think how is it going to be this new tour. 

But does every performance of her has to be highly energetic?  Why assume she must be "slowing down" because of it?  I don't get this sort of thinking, especially when the performance is quite "theatrical" and I believe the "static" nature you are referring to is intentional throughout the performance.

And I hate to bring up her age, because honestly Madonna still can dance circles "energetically" around people half her age, but let's be realistic here... I suspect if you were 60 years old, coming down a steep staircase with an eye patch over one eye, you would probably be far more cautious how you make each of her steps as well.  Also, I am not sure many fans take this in consideration, but it's apparent her eyesight isn't great as it used to be which is why we see her wearing eye glasses a lot behind the scenes.  Sure, she could ditch the eye patch, but why when that is all part of the visual make up for the persona she is channeling?

For me, it's a theatrical performance and she doesn't always have to come off with a choreography that is highly energetic to remain entertaining. 

[Andra]

5 minutes ago, reQuiem4adream said:

exactly! Listen to her performance of TPOG and you'll know.

Difference is that performance wasn't watched live by like 200 million people.

[White Heat]

7 minutes ago, john_andy said:

You might like the performance or not, which is okay, but if you pay attention to what's beneath the criticism, it's rather transparent that it has nothing to do with her singing abilities, but with the fact that some people just can't cope with her still being around. Madonna has not based her entire career on having amazing control over her voice: she's not what you can call a vocalist. She's much more than that. I could understand it if someone like, let's say, Celine Dion had a somewhat poor vocal performance, given that her great voice is basically what she has to offer (with all due respect to her amazing, amazing voice), I could understand the meltdown, the criticism, the fear. But we are talking about Madonna, who is a far superior performer and a totally different animal. Would anybody have said that Bob Dylan's career or David Bowie's career or John Lennon's career were over after a not-so-brilliant vocal delivery? Would anybody have limited their contributions to music to just a nice singing voice? That is blatantly trying to diminish her talents and downplay her impact on music and culture. 

Social media is, in a way, a celebration of simplistic thinking and reductivism (look it up). Do you imagine what would have happened had social media existed at the times of Frida Khalo or Picasso? "Damm, man, that dude can't get a damn nose straight. He can't get no eyes in the right place. My 6 year-old-boy can do better than that". Or... "And she thinks she can paint, she can't even get proportions right, man, no doubt she can't even fix her own eyebrows". What would they have said about Egon Schiele or Man Ray or Oscar Wilde or Virginia Woolf? Guess what? They would have torn them to shreds because they wouldn't have been able to understand them. Nor do they understand Madonna, simple as that. 

In the end, our generation is not ready for a woman like Madonna. Wait thirty or forty years and we'll see what happens then. They will celebrate her then. Meanwhile, they're too busy now complaining about the fact that —oh, surprise—, she's a human being and somehow imperfect. Her voice can fail, what a scandal! 

I think that if a provocateur can get people so polarized and so galvanized just for not being perfect, he or she might be doing something right. I'm certain Madonna is. 

 

100%

[Magnifico]

I like the performance, i like lap,

your voice, your attitude

And future it is fire 

Get off eurotrashvision

Madonna , she is artist

No a bitch for the audiance.

 

 

 

 

[lautert]

1 minute ago, Amelia said:

But does every performance of her has to be highly energetic?  Why assume she must be "slowing down" because of it?  I don't get this sort of thinking, especially when the performance is quite "theatrical" and I believe the "static" nature you are referring to is intentional throughout the performance.

 And I hate to bring up her age, because honestly Madonna still can dance circles "energetically" around people half her age, but let's be realistic here... I suspect if you were 60 years old, coming down a steep staircase with an eye patch over one eye, you would probably be far more cautious how you make each of her steps as well.  Also, I am not sure many fans take this in consideration, but it's apparent her eyesight isn't great as it used to be which is why we see her wearing eye glasses a lot behind the scenes.  Sure, she could ditch the eye patch, but why when that is all part of the visual make up for the persona she is channeling?

 For me, it's a theatrical performance and she doesn't always have to come off with a choreography that is highly energetic to remain entertaining. 

Of course not, but there's a difference between being theatrical and static. Most of the times in this performance I feel that she's static. It's undeniable she's slowing down, almost every performance lately. MDNA, BAT... and plenty of other concerts and performances had great theatrical moments and they were not static, so being theatrical is not an excuse for. 

About her age, we came back to the same discussion, then why using the stairs? why using the eye patch? If I'd feel less capeable of doing something, I'd make everything to easy the path for me. 

Anyway, slowing down or not, she is still Madonna. 

[rebelgirl]

1 minute ago, Andra said:

Difference is that performance wasn't watched live by like 200 million people.

Eurovision in Europe has a lot of impact.For better and for worse.

people who have not seen the performance and see those headlines the next day, 

They will think that Madonna made a terrible performance ... and it really is not like that.

as you said the performance has many political connotations..  many more than yesterday I could appreciate.

we are in troubled times, where getting into political issues is dangerous.

no one else than she would be able to do what she did yesterday in Israel, flags ...I can not think of another artist to do this..

[Jeby]

I have avoided social media most of the day so far and only logged on here for info. Grateful to see Boy george, Darren Hayes as fellow singers not rip into her. I hope we get some more. 

[Guest Amelia aka Neutrocks]

Just now, lautert said:

Of course not, but there's a difference between being theatrical and static. Most of the times in this performance I feel that she's static. It's undeniable she's slowing down, almost every performance lately. MDNA, BAT... and plenty of other concerts and performances had great theatrical moments and they were not static, so being theatrical is not an excuse for. 

About her age, we came back to the same discussion, then why using the stairs? why using the eye patch? If I'd feel less capeable of doing something, I'd make everything to easy the path for me. 

Anyway, slowing down or not, she is still Madonna. 

Why can't she use stairs, the eye patch?  Why can't she perform much more theatrically and yes, that's what's happening here.  It's not an excuse either.  Face it, she is 60 years old and YES that does play a role in how she prefers to perform.  I do think last night's performance was intentionally "static".  It's how she's incorporate a lot of her moves on her last tour, in a more theatrical presentation.  Still, it doesn't mean she's abandoned the high energy performances, but she's done that most of her career, so why must she keep doing that, especially at this stage in her career.  Again her age does play a factor in this.  Remember she IS human. She certainly has a lot of aches and pains like any one of us.  I'm sure she's purposely finding other ways to perform, to not only save her from any unfortunate accident, but to give far more variety to her shows. It's the same when she plays the guitar in one of her performances.  It offers something different than just a high energy dance routine.  If I want to see non-stop high energy performance I'd look back at her past live catalog and watch that.  Again, I don't believe she's necessarily abandoning that, but rather enhancing her shows with more variety, then the same thing all the time. 

[FreeMySoul]

Madonna posted this on her insta story:

 

[stevo208]

The only ones still talking about this see us. Her fans. Oh and Piers Morgan, but he can't have a wank without tweeting something nasty about Madonna. I say wank, I'm guessing he doesn't have a lot of sex. Also he practically stalks Madonna. 

[imakicola]

Remember the drake kiss?

That blew over. So will this

[karbatal]

3 minutes ago, FreeMySoul said:

Madonna posted this on her insta story:

 

True . 

I especially loved that she wanted to create something new instead of some tired old legend performance. Sometimes you win, others you don't and the world still turns.

[Guest Amelia aka Neutrocks]

27 minutes ago, john_andy said:

You might like the performance or not, which is okay, but if you pay attention to what's beneath the criticism, it's rather transparent that it has nothing to do with her singing abilities, but with the fact that some people just can't cope with her still being around. Madonna has not based her entire career on having amazing control over her voice: she's not what you can call a vocalist. She's much more than that. I could understand it if someone like, let's say, Celine Dion had a somewhat poor vocal performance, given that her great voice is basically what she has to offer (with all due respect to her amazing, amazing voice), I could understand the meltdown, the criticism, the fear. But we are talking about Madonna, who is a far superior performer and a totally different animal. Would anybody have said that Bob Dylan's career or David Bowie's career or John Lennon's career were over after a not-so-brilliant vocal delivery? Would anybody have limited their contributions to music to just a nice singing voice? That is blatantly trying to diminish her talents and downplay her impact on music and culture. 

Social media is, in a way, a celebration of simplistic thinking and reductivism (look it up). Do you imagine what would have happened had social media existed at the times of Frida Khalo or Picasso? "Damm, man, that dude can't get a damn nose straight. He can't get no eyes in the right place. My 6 year-old-boy can do better than that". Or... "And she thinks she can paint, she can't even get proportions right, man, no doubt she can't even fix her own eyebrows". What would they have said about Egon Schiele or Man Ray or Oscar Wilde or Virginia Woolf? Guess what? They would have torn them to shreds because they wouldn't have been able to understand them. Nor do they understand Madonna, simple as that. 

In the end, our generation is not ready for a woman like Madonna. Wait thirty or forty years and we'll see what happens then. They will celebrate her then. Meanwhile, they're too busy now complaining about the fact that —oh, surprise—, she's a human being and somehow imperfect. Her voice can fail, what a scandal! 

I think that if a provocateur can get people so polarized and so galvanized just for not being perfect, he or she might be doing something right. I'm certain Madonna is. 

 

Well put!  I've always felt this way when reading from fans who keep demanding a certain path in her career.  I'd think, would you tell how a painter or a writer how they should paint or write?  No!  It's their vision; their art.  If we start expecting and demanding how an artist should present themselves and perform their art, they are no longer an artist. They are just a puppet to society. 

I'm just thankful that Madonna allows the negativity and criticisms to drive her forward because most anyone else would have given up long ago.  There has to be a point that being a fan of anyone this long, you have had to adjust to the fact, that Madonna doesn't adhere to what people want and expect of her, she just does it her way! 

[Lolo]

1 hour ago, Nonoka said:

The spoken Dark Ballet interlude was a moment of performance art only M can pull off. The political message throughout was subtly built in while still quite clear in its delivery...."They think we don't know about their crimes". Add to that ending the performance with "Wake Up" flashing in big white letters on the screen. With the context of what is happening 1 hour away from Tel Aviv, all of that was fucking brave.

That part was EVERYTHING!!! I love it so much for those exact reasons and because it was so very poetic and theatrical. 

[Jeby]

I would like for her to address her voice. It has happened to so many and they all addressed it. When we act like it is just the same old sexist ageist Madonna bashing we have suffered the last thirty years, which 70% of it probably is but there is a bonafide criicism of her vocals on the night and an unnecessary use of autotune in a show with amateurs and you are the Queen. I mean it was just wrong decisions galore in my humble opinion. Song choice. Quavo. LAP arrangement wasn't even Met Gala to the T. The presentation yes but not the music.

I was defending her to my friends and they were like, how can you defend that vocal performance? I couldn't. It's a valid criticism on the night even though the haters are going overboard. 

ALL the so called vocalists have had bad days. So our girl who they can't stop telling us, can not sing, can have a bad day too. I am just hoping she realizes that this was a more than sub par performance and doesn't become all defensive and combative thinking it's just her usual critics. 

You had a bad day M. Drink some lemon tea. Start those vocal coaching lessons again. It's a theater tour this time. None of us are coming there to hear auto tune and vocoders in a small theater. I was watching Gambler from the Virgin Tour and Deeper and Deeper from The Girlie Show. Madonna CAN SING. I just do not know when she got lazy with her voice and started relying on these playbacks and auto tune effects etc. 

[AlanLongoria]

The flag dancer was detained and interrogated at the airport

 

[Lolasmommy]

The entire ROL era never had a decent live vocal performance (VMAs, EMAs, Grammys) & this to shall pass...

 

[Sjewell88]

I mean...in the history of M controversies isn’t this relatively tame?  So she sang LAP a little wonky and advocated for peace?  People proclaiming her career is over are laughable.  Like this negates 35 years of top notch live performance and the greatest discography in the history of pop music?  I hardly think so.  

I’m sure M wished she had sung LAP better but practically every pop vocalist has had a bad night and then got crucified for it the next day. (Mariah? whitney? Adele?) it’s just so much more vociferous exaggerated and relentless because of social media and because it’s Madonna.  

I admire her bravery and uncompromising attitude.  Eternally the non-conformist.  I’m just looking forward to what comes next. Videos, Dark Ballet and the album release!!!

[Guest ursula]

6 minutes ago, Lolasmommy said:

The entire ROL era never had a decent live vocal performance (VMAs, EMAs, Grammys) & this to shall pass...

 

Oprah's was good.

[Lolasmommy]

1 minute ago, ursula said:

Oprah's was good.

Ah yes lest we forget!

[Sky Fits Heaven]

1 hour ago, karbatal said:

Is this meltdown the biggest ever in Mafonnanation history? 

1 hour ago, AlanLongoria said:

Drake gate would like to have a word with you

48 minutes ago, Martin B. said:

Prince’s tribute says hi!

Candy Shop inclusion at MDNAT and RHT setlists is looking at you three.

[Lolo]

7 minutes ago, AlanLongoria said:

The flag dancer was detained and interrogated at the airport

 

Wow, unbelievable. 

[dollhouse]

1 hour ago, stoneroad said:

I don't understand the overwhelming negativity. Sure, LAP vocals were bad, as they often are, let's be honest. We all know she can sing given the right circumstances, even recently, La Vie en Rose from RHT comes to mind.

Everything from the end of LAP to the end I thought was fantastic! The spoken word part was amazing, getting me even more hyped for Dark Ballet, and Future was pretty good, became great because of the political message she was sending with it.

Anywaaay, if anyone wants to watch it in HQ, here you go:

https://www.svtplay.se/video/21980070/eurovision-song-contest-2019/eurovision-song-contest-2019-final-18-maj-21-00?highlight=mellanakt-med-madonna&position=10578&start=auto 

i agree. the performance as a whole was phenomal. esp. the 2nd act.

LAP needs a rest, anyway.

[lautert]

30 minutes ago, Amelia said:

Why can't she use stairs, the eye patch?  Why can't she perform much more theatrically and yes, that's what's happening here.  It's not an excuse either.  Face it, she is 60 years old and YES that does play a role in how she prefers to perform.  I do think last night's performance was intentionally "static".  It's how she's incorporate a lot of her moves on her last tour, in a more theatrical presentation.  Still, it doesn't mean she's abandoned the high energy performances, but she's done that most of her career, so why must she keep doing that, especially at this stage in her career.  Again her age does play a factor in this.  Remember she IS human. She certainly has a lot of aches and pains like any one of us.  I'm sure she's purposely finding other ways to perform, to not only save her from any unfortunate accident, but to give far more variety to her shows. It's the same when she plays the guitar in one of her performances.  It offers something different than just a high energy dance routine.  If I want to see non-stop high energy performance I'd look back at her past live catalog and watch that.  Again, I don't believe she's necessarily abandoning that, but rather enhancing her shows with more variety, then the same thing all the time. 

Of course she plays a role in whatever she does, but we are not obligated to praise everything she does as well, and it doesnt make us lesser fans or anything like this, just because we didn't enjoy something she has done. 

No one said she's abandoning anything, we are only giving our opinions, don't overreact over this, we are all Madonna's fans and we all love her.

[mr_boogiewoogie]

23 minutes ago, AlanLongoria said:

The flag dancer was detained and interrogated at the airport

 

Those who were expecting her to capitalize on the exposure to promote her current single and her upcoming album, you are so naive!

Madonna has proved the kind of ARTIST that she is. Yes, she could have performed Medellin. That would have been the easy route, but she’s not that. She’s the one to take the road less traveled by.

Instead, she used that platform to spread a message of love, unity and compassion and Like a Prayer, Dark Ballet and Future just happened to be the perfect platform to get the message across. The opportunity was too important, too big, too precious to let it pass by. She went and did exactly that!

Thank God she was not perfect during Like a Prayer. Once again she’s putting herself up on that cross for public ludicrium, harassment and abuse but while this happens the discussion is open and some people are starting to understand the real intention behind the performance.

It was not about proving that she is the Queen - no need for that, she has 35 years of proof and evidence. It was about giving a contribution to making this world a better place. We have a lot to learn from this. It’s true, the storm is inside of us, the battleground is within us and it is up to each and every one of us to work on ourselves in order to wake up, learn from the past,  open our minds, open our eyes and propel ourselves into the FUTURE, which is NOT recreating the past as it has been happening. This is what Future is all about. 

I’M FUCKING PROUD OF HER!

[karbatal]

17 minutes ago, AlanLongoria said:

The flag dancer was detained and interrogated at the airport

 

Wow