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EUROVISION! The aftermath!


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15 minutes ago, boy skeffington said:

With Drake performance it was she was too old and too disgusting to see kiss anyone.

With Prince tribute performance it was she is not the appropriate person to do the tribute. 

With VMAs the fact she spoke about herself somehow was disrespectful to Aretha Franklin

Stonewall she has ass implants 

Eurovision she can’t sing 

I understand this is simplified and that some folks do not like these performances/appearances based on artistic merit and such. That said, yes, the extreme vitriol and outrage is clearly about something deeper. She’s always had this effect but with outrage culture and social media it’s growing. They want to see her destroyed, cancelled so the outrage police will find the “weakness” wherever they can.

I continue to just find joy, inspiration and a role model in Madonna and her art. I never think the reaction/outrage matches the thing being complained about. 

 

 

 

This!!!

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12 minutes ago, Voguerista said:

I agree that there were some vocal issues (but I don't believe this was her fault. It could have been her earpiece technical issue which could be why they were able to fix it ). Everything else was fire for me. I loved the theatricalness. I loved the costuming and I especially loved the choreography. It took my breath away when her dancers rolled down the stairs. It took my breath away when they were all synchronized in line etc. And the backdrops ...they were powerful.  Pure pure art and with a powerful message on love and peace without blaming any one country. Even with a vocal issue of whatever kind, it was beautiful and powerful art with a message.  And she's only human. God bless Madonna. 

I love your spirit, which we all can understand, because we are all M fans and that is why we are not the same as those idiots who never got her. 

But still, regarding the vocals, like many have pointed out, she needs some training at this point. And the voice should be given the most attention when she does her REHEARSALS. Now it's just sad to see fans being like "Oh every performer had A bad night", well she has had too many bad NIGHTS at this point that it is worrisome for her reputation as a performing artist. For how long can we keep blaming the earpiece, the sickness, or whatever possible element we can think of as an excuse? That's a major issue that we simply cannot ignore. 

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Embarrassing

Boring

Weird

Awful

Excruciating

This is the description from people I know on Madonna's performance. And every one of them was so looking forward to it. None are diehards fans, but all like her. This is what people are thinking about the performance and we just need to move on from it. We need to wake up from a fuzzy dream and hope and pray she delivers some killer performances in the upcoming weeks to make them eat their words. 

 

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I love what she was doing conceptually:

A woman (joan of arc) in a patriarchal world (monks), she calls them out in segueway (imagery of religious priests and monks), then an upbeat urgent song about apocalipsy and the future hope for mankind taking masks of, robots, becoming human again, peace. 

 

Musically LAP was as conceptual as could be: almost acapella with a new arrangement of greogorian chants and a spare organ. Future is her experimenting with new sound as she always has through her career.

 

I applaud her for sticking to her conceptual vision.

 

However she does not make it easy for herself. Ive loved from her that she plays the game so you can reach more people and make more of an impact.

This was Eurovision with a giant audience that could have attuned people to be more open to her and her message at least a little. I was with gays, one said as she was being interviewed “why is she even there”. A good number of people dont like her because she is a strong woman, what she stands for and because she has been around too long.

So it would have been nice for people to watch this performance and at least say ok “i may not love her but thats why shes Madonna”

thats not to say i dont applaud her and loved her performance and Im so happy with this era.

But...

I rewatched LAP live 8 and RIT her vocals were not amazing, they were good/fine. But the rich arrangament, full choir and back up singers take the song to another level. That song is a formula that strikes a chord. I think it would have been wise to get people excited and warm up to her in such a big event then still have a political message.

A little montage of videos of her career at the beginning or sing one of her joyous past hits would have been good to. I know a little lame but people need to remember who she is and how important her legacy is in pop music. Theyll take it for granted.

 

But I respect what this is what she wanted to do- and i liked it. Had it been a tour i get it, but for this perfomance it was going to be challenging for a good reaction.

Can I say that while Ive loved Megans choreo for the MET and for Medellin video, i didnt LOVE it for Medellin BBMA or for Eurovision? They are okay but not amazing. It all looks a bit rushed put together.

Anyways, love this era. Love what we have in store. Loving the music, the visuals

 

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4 hours ago, Kim said:

Just listen to this poor woman (who represents all of our friends and family who tuned in to see Madonna) listening to the unedited version of LAP. Preferable with headphones.

Then maybe we can all collectively ask ourselves what the fuck is going on with Madonna's voice?

 

While these vocals were obviously not great; I feel like she's had worse live vocals before though; thats why reading alot the press articles and social media comments felt extreme. also like she's not allowed to have an "off" day. I've seen bad live perfs from all singers. 

When I heard these original vocals, My first thought was I think she must have alot of anxiety. it affects your breathing and output. where you try to overcompensate and push the vocals as opposed to letting them come out effortlessly. it was like she was fighting a panic attack. add to that not being able to hear herself may have aggravated it more.

who knows though. 

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2 minutes ago, Crystal Coffin said:

I love your spirit, which we all can understand, because we are all M fans and that is why we are not the same as those idiots who never got her. 

But still, regarding the vocals, like many have pointed out, she needs some training at this point. And the voice should be given the most attention when she does her REHEARSALS. Now it's just sad to see fans being like "Oh every performer had A bad night", well she has had too many bad NIGHTS at this point that it is worrisome for her reputation as a performing artist. For how long can we keep blaming the earpiece, the sickness, or whatever possible element we can think of as an excuse? That's a major issue that we simply cannot ignore. 

Ignore it ( cause she can sing ) or just follow the reasons why you like her as a performer , of it doesn t male you feel good just be true to yourself and that s it

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3 hours ago, horn said:

The woman was right about one thing: Madonna was singing while walking down the stairs i.e. trying to watch the steps while catching her breath.

And also, I suspect it's either M didn't warm up her vocal before the performance or she had been rehearsing for too many times and hurt her vocal.

Didn't everyone say she's not a singer since day one?  

She & her fans have NEVER bragged about her octave or having an amazing voice whatever shit in the first place.

So why criticized her vocal? She's not Pariah or Shitney.

Anyway it's still better than her 1997 VMA / 2005 Live 8 ROL last screeching note (end of the ROL song) which was total out of tune.

 

You said it right there sister! Can everyone please move on?

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4 hours ago, Kim said:

Just listen to this poor woman (who represents all of our friends and family who tuned in to see Madonna) listening to the unedited version of LAP. Preferable with headphones.

Then maybe we can all collectively ask ourselves what the fuck is going on with Madonna's voice?

 

I watched this and the video she posted of the performance was so distorted. I usually like vocal coach but she isn't a great at observation. In her Madonna Best Vocals post she failed to spot that the performance of Frozen was her miming to a backing track. So she's not that great in my opinion!!!?!

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Who really gives a flying fuck what these nobody vocal coaches online have to say 🤣

theres more chance of my living room sofa having a music hit than them....M is on Eurovision they are on YouTube.

Enough said. 

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5 minutes ago, eroticerotic said:

While these vocals were obviously not great; I feel like she's had worse live vocals before though; thats why reading alot the press articles and social media comments felt extreme. also like she's not allowed to have an "off" day. I've seen bad live perfs from all singers. 

When I heard these original vocals, My first thought was I think she must have alot of anxiety. it affects your breathing and output. where you try to overcompensate and push the vocals as opposed to letting them come out effortlessly. it was like she was fighting a panic attack. add to that not being able to hear herself may have aggravated it more.

who knows though. 

She shoulda just lipped to a fake "live" track like before. No close ups to give the game away anyway. I'll give her the benefit of the doubt and say she was under the weather. The rehearsal clip was just as bad if not worse afterall. The minute we heard them all laughing at her we knew something was up.

2 minutes ago, JWAD said:

I watched this and the video she posted of the performance was so distorted. I usually like vocal coach but she isn't a great at observation. In her Madonna Best Vocals post she failed to spot that the performance of Frozen was her miming to a backing track. So she's not that great in my opinion!!!?!

It's not what she says really, it's her overall reaction,. It's so similar to what so many of us experienced sitting there with friends, family etc. A collective "OH DEAR"

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6 minutes ago, Eltacubo said:

Can I say that while Ive loved Megans choreo for the MET and for Medellin video, i didnt LOVE it for Medellin BBMA or for Eurovision? They are okay but not amazing. It all looks a bit rushed put together.

Anyways, love this era. Love what we have in store. Loving the music, the visuals

 

There a lot of things that look a bit rushed in this era. She filmed for months all this footage and then she filmed two music videos before the release of the singles, one of which has not even appeared yet. Eurovision performance had bad choreography, was clumsy and looked like it was last minute decisions, Quavo looked like he had no clue what he was doing. I even think the JPG costume was still being sown at last minute then he just chucked some netting all over it. Medellín at BBMAs was fun though but again didn't have that oomph it needed. I think the collaborations with Swae Lee and Maluma were last minute and were to get a hit but at least thes e have had great outcomes! Where the fuck is the Crave video? Nuno is too busy documenting behind the scenes

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9 minutes ago, Kim said:

She shoulda just lipped to a fake "live" track like before. No close ups to give the game away anyway. I'll give her the benefit of the doubt and say she was under the weather. The rehearsal clip was just as bad if not worse afterall. The minute we heard them all laughing at her we knew something was up.

It's not what she says really, it's her overall reaction,. It's so similar to what so many of us experienced sitting there with friends, family etc. A collective "OH DEAR"

Sorry I should clarify I didn't mean her opinion was distorted. The video she was critiquing of the performance was very low res and did sound like it had autotune on it due to that Limewire mp3 0.5mb effect. She sounded like she was underwater. I don't think she was actually see the proper performance as I could hear absolutely no autotune on Like A Prayer.

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4 minutes ago, JWAD said:

There a lot of things that look a bit rushed in this era. She filmed for months all this footage and then she filmed two music videos before the release of the singles, one of which has not even appeared yet. Eurovision performance had bad choreography, was clumsy and looked like it was last minute decisions, Quavo looked like he had no clue what he was doing. I even think the JPG costume was still being sown at last minute then he just chucked some netting all over it. Medellín at BBMAs was fun though but again didn't have that oomph it needed. I think the collaborations with Swae Lee and Maluma were last minute and were to get a hit but at least thes e have had great outcomes! Where the fuck is the Crave video? Nuno is too busy documenting behind the scenes

For sure. Dont get me wrong it doesnt feel rushed like Rebel Heart rushed. The concept, artwork, medellin video and the music all sounds like she has put a LOT of time perfecting them. I do think there is a lot of stuff they shot and will release where a lot of the work has gone into. I refused to believe she was rehearsing for Medellin BBMA for 3 weeks.... the AR yes but not her in a rehersal studio. More stuff is coming.

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14 minutes ago, reQuiem4adream said:

You said it right there sister! Can everyone please move on?

No SINGER should be from criticism on the vocal department because singing is what they essentially do in their life, please. Madonna, Britney, Paula Abdul, Elvis, Kate Bush, Bruno Mars, Mick Jagger, all these different characters are singers, all have voices that are supposed to be able to carry a tune, so no, the world will not "move on".

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8 minutes ago, JWAD said:

Sorry I should clarify I didn't mean her opinion was distorted. The video she was critiquing of the performance was very low res and did sound like it had autotune on it due to that Limewire mp3 0.5mb effect. She sounded like she was underwater. I don't think she was actually see the proper performance as I could hear absolutely no autotune on Like A Prayer.

Someone said she uses something to kinda isolate the vocals when she critiques them.

I do notice on the original vocal (and absent on the new) that there's some sort of effect going on during LAP,  it's not a backing track but some sort of echo type process going on in the background which could possibly be this "live autotune" that some people use and if done improperly can make the whole thing sound even worse. 

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27 minutes ago, JWAD said:

I watched this and the video she posted of the performance was so distorted. I usually like vocal coach but she isn't a great at observation. In her Madonna Best Vocals post she failed to spot that the performance of Frozen was her miming to a backing track. So she's not that great in my opinion!!!?!

She's a vocal coach and not a detective to spot perfect lip-syncing. She said the Vogue vocals were great and that's right. She said Madonna didn't hit one note on Like a Prayer and she is right again. The woman is a Madonna fan and praises Madonna if she delivers good singing (Sooner or Later).

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14 minutes ago, Miphiwart said:

Did anybody  note that her esc performance is trending 1# im youtube germany right now?

 

It's also got 1.5m views in 23 hours and about 300k in the last few hours. The Crave audio video has the same views and this has been out for 10 days. Will these numbers count towards Like A Prayer and Future?

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10 minutes ago, Bette Davis Dub said:

She's a vocal coach and not a detective to spot perfect lip-syncing. She said the Vogue vocals were great and that's right. She said Madonna didn't hit one note on Like a Prayer and she is right again. The woman is a Madonna fan and praises Madonna if she delivers good singing (Sooner or Later).

Don't get me wrong, I really like the woman, she is lovely and I subscribe to her page. But come on a vocal coach should know a live vocal and you can clearly see in the video she's lip syncing. 

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20 minutes ago, Kim said:

Someone said she uses something to kinda isolate the vocals when she critiques them.

I do notice on the original vocal (and absent on the new) that there's some sort of effect going on during LAP,  it's not a backing track but some sort of echo type process going on in the background which could possibly be this "live autotune" that some people use and if done improperly can make the whole thing sound even worse. 

Yeah I think she uses the echo all the time now and didn't know the coach isolates the vocals. I thought she just watched the performance from a dodgy stream. This makes sense...

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Why she doesn’t understand that she doesn’t need to try hard. Shes the fucking queen of pop. She earned her status and she doesn’t need to prove anything to anyone. Now she’s trying to hard with all these heavy costumes grillz and that crappy eyepatch. Minimal Madonna is the best Madonna.  It really hurts when i see all this negativity. She had perfect opportunity to make best promo for a new era and she fucked up, fucked up hard.   Now all Europe talking how bad she was, how bad she looked and sounded. Let’s wait few more days and everyone will forgets all that mess. 

Edited by Royal T
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1 minute ago, JWAD said:

Don't get me wrong, I really like the woman, she is lovely and I subscribe to her page. But come on a vocal coach should know a live vocal and you can clearly see in the video she's lip syncing. 

Not only was she lip syncing, but the video in that clip is taken from an unofficial remix of "Frozen". It's not even the original live audio feed.

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5 minutes ago, Royal T said:

Why she doesn’t understand that she doesn’t need to try hard. Shes the fucking queen of pop. She earned her status and she doesn’t need to prove anything to anyone. Now she’s trying to hard with all these heavy costumes grillz and that crappy eyepatch. Minimal Madonna is the best Madonna.  It really hurts when i see all this negativity. She had perfect opportunity to make best promo for a new era and she fucked up, fucked up hard.   Now all Europe talking how bad she was, how bad she looked and sounded. Let’s wait few more days and everyone will forgets all that mess. 

I think she needs to be challenged and passionate about what she a doing. If she made it simple, made it banal, made it easy then she wouldnt do it anymore...

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20 minutes ago, Mattress said:

Not only was she lip syncing, but the video in that clip is taken from an unofficial remix of "Frozen". It's not even the original live audio feed.

I think the vocal coach is primarily judging the voice and is not trying to throw singers under the bus.

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The performance was visually arresting and beautiful. I didn't mind the flat notes on "Prayer", and though it's her/her team's prerogative to enhance the vocals for the official upload, I find it unnecessary.

As they did smooth out her vocals, it would probably be in her best interest to acknowledge what was likely an issue with her in-ear feed anyway... but Madonna's always been a uniquely unapologetic, flaws-and-all behemoth. No need to change that now or ever.

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14 minutes ago, Eltacubo said:

I think she needs to be challenged and passionate about what she a doing. If she made it simple, made it banal, made it easy then she wouldnt do it anymore...

Yeah but you can be passionate about your work but you don't need gimmicks. The eye patch doesn't work and certainly not during a performance. The grillz limit her singing and you can't even see them on the TV. You can be stylish and have a theme (see Confessions and MDNA) but when you overdo it, it becomes a bit tacky (see Hard Candy boxer). Ditch the patch. Ditch those fucking grillz. Long live the Queen.

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Here's a ROUGH example of in-ear monitors gone awry. Live on the Today show, Debbie Harry sang the first few lines of this song in a completely different key than the rest of the music.

(starts @ 2:02)

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