Beastialg Posted February 23 Posted February 23 10 minutes ago, Confessit said: I remember when it was first confirmed Madonna was collaborating with Maluma, this forum went into a frenzy and there were many many fans who were convinced she was going to have a huge smash with Maluma because of his massive proven commercial platform online. As you say it just didnât work out that way with Madonna. When it comes to collaborations it isnât always straight forward. Maluma was never massive in the USA or the UK. He doesn't even have a Top 40 in either market. He was not Bad Bunny (or Sabrina Carpenter in this case) He is big in Latin America, but the reason the song flopped is because of the song itself. It's not commercial, it's both in english and spanish, it has a weird structure and production and doesn't sound like something people who like latin music would listen to.Â
elijah Posted February 23 Posted February 23 5 minutes ago, systemvalues said: But the purpose of a collaboration between two singers, artistic considerations aside, is to increase the sales of a song. It's an attempt. Then, if the song doesn't resonate with the public or is rejected by their respective fanbases, that's another thing... But the one that matters most. I always thought (obviously naively) that a collaboration's point is to create a great song first and foremost.... The mere calculation: to just mix Madonna with popular, trashy sound, never never have the desired result. And that's obvious since at least 2004. A collab with Pet Shop Boys could have worked on COADF2.
burning_up Posted February 23 Posted February 23 1 hour ago, Jairo said: Arca is not an urban artist AT ALL lmao she is an experimental and electronic DJ, several of her albums are high ranked on Pitchfork and the critics love her. I saw her performing in Colombia a few years ago and she is not a reggaeton/urban singer at all. Love that Madonna is collaborating with underground artists like Arca who is also a trans woman and very talented  Agreed. Totally here for an Arca collab. Love her solo stuff and her recent remixes for Robyn and Addison Rae are fab. I much prefer when Madonna collaborates with a more edgy/avant-garde producer than another pop star.Â
systemvalues Posted February 23 Posted February 23 2 minutes ago, bardo said: right but if you're going to do something that looks "desperate" it better be a hit or you did it for nothing. at least i like sabrina so there's a good chance i'll enjoy it either way, but many m fans don't feel that way. That's for sure..better a good and successful song to make money from... a further stimulus for the haters' comments.
dollhouse Posted February 23 Posted February 23 6 minutes ago, Beastialg said: Maluma was never massive in the USA or the UK. He doesn't even have a Top 40 in either market. He was not Bad Bunny (or Sabrina Carpenter in this case) He is big in Latin America, but the reason the song flopped is because of the song itself. It's not commercial, it's both in english and spanish, it has a weird structure and production and doesn't sound like something people who like latin music would listen to. it was very unconventional song indeed At least Boy George liked it, hes a great song writer
systemvalues Posted February 23 Posted February 23 8 minutes ago, elijah said: I always thought (obviously naively) that a collaboration's point is to create a great song first and foremost.... The mere calculation: to just mix Madonna with popular, trashy sound, never never have the desired result. And that's obvious since at least 2004. A collab with Pet Shop Boys could have worked on COADF2. And I agree with you, that's why I wrote "artistic considerations aside".
Confessit II Posted February 23 Posted February 23 8 minutes ago, Beastialg said: Maluma was never massive in the USA or the UK. He doesn't even have a Top 40 in either market. He was not Bad Bunny (or Sabrina Carpenter in this case) He is big in Latin America, but the reason the song flopped is because of the song itself. It's not commercial, it's both in english and spanish, it has a weird structure and production and doesn't sound like something people who like latin music would listen to. I hear you and agree totally. But with MX Madonna obviously didnât care about commerciality or penetrating the mainstream. There feels like a shift back to wanting to create something popular within pop music itself this time, I mean she hooked back up with Price for starters! So maybe this time itâs different. Didnât they say the lead single was Hung Ups heir and a killer song? I assume this Sabrina track is the lead single so therefore, with her platform on streaming we could actually be seeing a fairly sizeable hit but more importantly, a song that penetrates within the mainstream. Something catchy & strong with repeat value. She hasnât had a lead like that for over 10 years!!!
DreamTheater Posted February 23 Posted February 23 Obviously the song needs to be good too. A big-name collab on its own is no guarantee. The thing is a solo Madonna single will struggle, no matter its quality. Sabrina Carpenter has what it takes to give it the push it needs to connect with a wider public. And sorry, but these "desperate" comments don't matter in the real world, they may be thrown around a lot in small internet bubbles, but they have very little impact.
runa Posted February 23 Posted February 23 11 minutes ago, burning_up said: Agreed. Totally here for an Arca collab. Love her solo stuff and her recent remixes for Robyn and Addison Rae are fab. I much prefer when Madonna collaborates with a more edgy/avant-garde producer than another pop star. I agree. I have nothing against Sabrina, but I'm way more happy with ARCA if those rumors are true.Â
bard Posted February 23 Posted February 23 sadly i think a song by a major artist featuring madonna (like "popular") has a much better chance at success than a madonna song featuring a popular artist.Â
systemvalues Posted February 23 Posted February 23 9 minutes ago, DreamTheater said: these "desperate" comments don't matter in the real world, they may be thrown around a lot in small internet bubbles, but they have very little impact. Â , everything is "desperate", "flop", "embarassing"...but how many of these comments come from people with a bias?
dollhouse Posted February 23 Posted February 23 5 minutes ago, bardo said: sadly i think a song by a major artist featuring madonna (like "popular") has a much better chance at success than a madonna song featuring a popular artist. popular had also playboicarti which had his fans
Confessit II Posted February 23 Posted February 23 8 minutes ago, DreamTheater said: Obviously the song needs to be good too. A big-name collab on its own is no guarantee. The thing is a solo Madonna single will struggle, no matter its quality. Sabrina Carpenter has what it takes to give it the push it needs to connect with a wider public. And sorry, but these "desperate" comments don't matter in the real world, they may be thrown around a lot in small internet bubbles, but they have very little impact. In a perfect world maybe but not in reality. If the lead single is with Sabrina then I think Madonna will absolutely be called desperate by far more than internet bubbles BUT if the song is quality it will capture the publics imagination and hopefully, find its audience. But I think itâs naive to think Madonna wonât be called out for collaborating with a much younger artist to try and get a hit. I think many parts of the mainstream press will jump all over the fact Madonna is 67 and Sabrina is 25, thatâs just how it will be.
dollhouse Posted February 23 Posted February 23 14 minutes ago, Confessit said: In a perfect world maybe but not in reality. If the lead single is with Sabrina then I think Madonna will absolutely be called desperate by far more than internet bubbles BUT if the song is quality it will capture the publics imagination and hopefully, find its audience. But I think itâs naive to think Madonna wonât be called out for collaborating with a much younger artist to try and get a hit. I think many parts of the mainstream press will jump all over the fact Madonna is 67 and Sabrina is 25, thatâs just how it will be. then those rags dont know everybody does features these days, even young artists
Shaun Posted February 23 Posted February 23 Seeing this thread is hot, clicking excitedly, and reading a post-mortem on MedellĂn.
alquemist Posted February 23 Posted February 23 Love Sabrina! Her Tears video / VMA performance and Manchild at SNL / the Grammys are the most entertaining and catchy moments since like... forever / the Celebration Tour.
stevo208 Posted February 23 Posted February 23 Arca has recently worked with Addison Rae... just saying. I'm here for Arca, I'm here for Sabrina and I hope she has another top 10 single in the US and UK because of it. I have thought that this may well be the last album we get from her and if she wants a hit to make sure it stays around for a little bit, then I'm all for it. She's worked on this for around 18 months that we know of... its gonna be fucking good. Let's get excited, enough of the 'desperate' comments or lamenting the collabs. Enjoy the return of the queen
Shaun Posted February 23 Posted February 23 3 minutes ago, stevo208 said: Arca has recently worked with Addison Rae... just saying. I'm here for Arca, I'm here for Sabrina and I hope she has another top 10 single in the US and UK because of it. I have thought that this may well be the last album we get from her and if she wants a hit to make sure it stays around for a little bit, then I'm all for it. She's worked on this for around 18 months that we know of... its gonna be fucking good. Let's get excited, enough of the 'desperate' comments or lamenting the collabs. Enjoy the return of the queen Excellent post, I share in your attitude and excitement!
Confessit II Posted February 23 Posted February 23 5 minutes ago, Shaun said: Seeing this thread is hot, clicking excitedly, and reading a post-mortem on MedellĂn. It wasnât anything great then and hasnât aged any better either. But life goes on
peter Posted February 23 Posted February 23 2 hours ago, bardo said: that's who i was referring to but confirmed there's another more established songwriter/performer on the album in addition to sabrina and (probably) arca.  they're not all on the same track. confirmed with who? sorry, did i miss something? i get that Sabrina is sort of an unofficial/unconfirmed but, Matt Rettenmund is saying it so it must hold water. Which I buy. But how are Arca and this third artist entering the picture in such a seemingly certain way?
systemvalues Posted February 23 Posted February 23 5 minutes ago, peter said: confirmed with who? sorry, did i miss something? i get that Sabrina is sort of an unofficial/unconfirmed but, Matt Rettenmund is saying it so it must hold water. Which I buy. But how are Arca and this third artist entering the picture in such a seemingly certain way?  Because Rettenmund posted this: https://www.instagram.com/p/DU4nL5ADqej/. as Nikki outlined.
peter Posted February 23 Posted February 23 (edited) 19 minutes ago, systemvalues said:  Because Rettenmund posted this: https://www.instagram.com/p/DU4nL5ADqej/. as Nikki outlined. Okay, thanks, but I was also asking about the mysterious third artist. Mattâs post says âjust becauseâ ⌠that isnât quite as firm a declaration of collaboration as his back-and-forth with Keith Caulfield (re: Sabrina), which I did see Nikki posted here (thank you, Nikki) Edit to add: Okay, so Iâm slow ⌠I understand how the âjust becauseâ on one (Arca) is then used on the other (Sabrina) by Rettenmund. So that makes it a little firmer. Sorry for not following that detail the first time. (In my defense, the thread is âhot,â so moving fast, but most of it, as Shaun pointed out, is opinions on past stuff. The details of developing rumors is a little lost in the shuffle.) I still donât see a reference to a third artist who is not David Banda. Edited February 23 by peter added further apologies
Marcelox Posted February 23 Posted February 23 4 minutes ago, peter said: Okay, thanks, but I was asking about the mysterious third artist. Mattâs post says âjust becauseâ ⌠that isnât quite as firm a declaration of collaboration as his back-and-forth with Keith Caulfield (re: Sabrina), which I did see Nikki posted here (thank you, Nikki) He also said thereâs an artist she collaborated with on the new album and that theyâve never been photographed together.. So it canât be Arca Â
peter Posted February 23 Posted February 23 2 minutes ago, Marcelox said: He also said thereâs an artist she collaborated with on the new album and that theyâve never been photographed together.. So it canât be Arca  Okay â thanks. I canât see everything on IG sometimes (like comments, and full captions). I appreciate so much when people have screen caps and such â extra thanks to @Nikki for posting that exchange between Keith Caulfield and Matthew Rettenmund earlier. And thanks to you, @Marcelox, and to you, @systemvalues, for helping catch me up to speed. Very much appreciated!
systemvalues Posted February 23 Posted February 23 11 minutes ago, peter said: Okay, thanks, but I was also asking about the mysterious third artist. Mattâs post says âjust becauseâ ⌠that isnât quite as firm a declaration of collaboration as his back-and-forth with Keith Caulfield (re: Sabrina), which I did see Nikki posted here (thank you, Nikki) Edit to add: Okay, so Iâm slow ⌠I understand how the âjust becauseâ on one (Arca) is then used on the other (Sabrina) by Rettenmund. So that makes it a little firmer. Sorry for not following that detail the first time. (In my defense, the thread is âhot,â so moving fast, but most of it, as Shaun pointed out, is opinions on past stuff. The details of developing rumors is a little lost in the shuffle.) I still donât see a reference to a third artist who is not David Banda. I think someone talked about the involvement of David on some forum and It was reported here.
systemvalues Posted February 23 Posted February 23 8 minutes ago, Marcelox said: He also said thereâs an artist she collaborated with on the new album and that theyâve never been photographed together.. So it canât be Arca  And neither Elton.
Gabriel Ciccone Posted February 23 Posted February 23 Where did this rumor start? Sabrina and Madonna? At this point, I'd rather wait than believe any rumors
peter Posted February 23 Posted February 23 1 minute ago, systemvalues said: I think someone talked about the involvement of David on some forum and It was reported here. Yeah, I think youâre right⌠Sorry, it just seemed things suddenly started becoming âconfirmed unofficially (by rumor mill)â today⌠wasnât sure what was âold rumorâ and what was a newer âmore certainâ development. I know itâs all still unofficial, but slightly more substantiated by the source and the âfactâ that we believe there was a shoot recently⌠Thanks!
Marcelox Posted February 23 Posted February 23 1 minute ago, systemvalues said: And neither Elton. But he mentioned a collab with a "major songwriter" too.. Could be Elton or Max? Â
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