Rollap Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Hey guys, someone posted an article about the Madonna fall where a female journalist defended her...sort of. Can't find the link but basically they said she showed what a great feminist she was but that they were never enamoured with her 'lightweight pop' career. Don't know about you guys but, while she's no Radiohead, I find she has plenty of adult orientated and deep songs. Which songs would you list to refute this allegation, as examples of her 'intelligent' or 'deep' songs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Django Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 whoever says "lightweight" pop about Madonna's career should be impaled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rollap Posted February 28, 2015 Author Share Posted February 28, 2015 I would choose: Mer Girl Secret Garden Easy Ride Devil Pray Live To Tell Falling Free Oh Father Swim Candy Perfume Girl Gone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocknrolla Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 I would say she has released light weight singles since at least confessions, for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Pud Whacker Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 madonna is in a league of her own. so let stupid people say what they want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 This is a non-issue for me. I would rather have a conversation with a toilet seat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sloane Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 If anything, Madonna is hardcore pop. This ain't creamy smooth disney shit.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madonnasuperfan01 Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Ugh why are so many "journalists" writing so much crap about Madonna and her career? Yeah she does have lightweight pop songs for sure but SO MANY of her songs aren't. We're talking about Madonna here, not some pop tart. It's ridiculous how underrated she is despite all her success. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazzy Jan Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 I get very annoyed when people keep putting Madonna's "Pop" career down. It is fruitless, stupid and ignorant. Madonna is the Queen of Pop and unlike some people, I think it is something to be proud of and celebrate. Some people just hate anything that is popular and want to think that they are above others. They should just listen to their indie artists who often only last a year and stop trying to pigeon hole Madonna or put her career down. Plus, Madonna has so many varied songs. She sings Pop music better than anyone and the same with ballads. Plus has so many different, original and unusual songs in her catalogue. The fact her music is so varied in style, lyrics, mood and genre is wonderful. Just listen to Live to Tell, Joan of Arc, Like a Prayer, Ghosttown, What it feels like for a girl, to name but a few and they have deep messages. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rollap Posted February 28, 2015 Author Share Posted February 28, 2015 A fried of mine says that the Beatles wrote more intelligent stuff which weren't about themselves like Taxman and Eleanor Rigby. But I think M doesnt necessarily write about herself, she often puts herself in someone else's shoes so it appears that the song is about her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Icykiller Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Ugh why are so many "journalists" writing so much crap about Madonna and her career? Yeah she does have lightweight pop songs for sure but SO MANY of her songs aren't. We're talking about Madonna here, not some pop tart. It's ridiculous how underrated she is despite all her success. I know, right! What is the deal lately with people writing crap and not focusing on the amazing music she just released? I would say her first album is definitely not lightweight pop, but LAV and TB are, then from LAP up until AL her songs are anything but lightweight pop. COAD to MDNA are a mixed bag, but she decided to release a lot of lightweight pop as singles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sloane Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Apparently the ppl calling her music lightweight pop never heard, Gang Bang. LAP is far from fluff. True Blue and Cherish, yes, Frozen and Paradise Not For Me, NO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazzy Jan Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 I have to say though that the songs some consider "lightweight pop" are brilliant wonderful songs and should not be put down. I presume people are talking about classics such as Holiday, Like a Virgin, Dress you up, Into the Groove, True Blue, Causing a commotion and Lucky Star. I don't care less if some want to call them lightweight pop, they are brilliant and nothing to be ashamed of by any stretch of the imagination. I consider Into the Groove to be complete dance pop perfection and am extremely proud of that song as a fan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocknrolla Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 I consider lightweight to be disposable, throwaway. Like GMAYL, 4 minutes. I wouldn't call any of her classics, that. I'm not sure what the critics are getting at, though. Oh, I hate how the Beatles are always so highly praised. Yes, they've had some very good songs. But they've had some crap too, like I wanna hold your hand, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5iVe Elements Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 See the Music and Ray of Light albums. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HolidayGuy Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 The early material, and some thereafter, could be "lightweight pop," but even they pack a wallop and often transcend that more than the typical pop fare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rb19 Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 I would call Madonna's "pop" output lightweight. Songs like 4 Minutes, Holiday, Into the Groove, Music etc. However: 1: A lot of Madonna's output, the majority probably, I would call transcendent pop, they're songs that, if performed by other artists, wouldn't be pop, that she makes pop because 2: Madonna herself is the definition of heavyweight pop. She is the pop icon. She moves pop culture to places it wouldn't be otherwise, she brings serious issues to light, emotional issues to the fore, visual art, film, dancing, photography, songwriting, performance. In all those respects she is the opposite of lightweight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruey Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 She probably has an equal number of songs in both the "lightweight" and "heavier" more complex pop camps. Definitely more complex songs than most mainstream and commercial pop artists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VogueMusic Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 "Lightweight"....? As Sloane said, she's hardcore pop, if anything..... But her brilliance is also in having such a wide array of sounds, genres, tempos, etc... she can do anything. I think that threatens a lot of people...especially music snobs. Music is, overall, very territorial ... and that's just another boundary she continues to push...another rule she does NOT follow. Plus, her lighter, more pop/dance orientated songs are some of the best musical compositions and arrangements EVER. They may not be lyrically/conceptually heavy, but it's some of the best, if not the best, popular music ever done. Hello...that's why she's the QUEEN. She earned that title...in every way. They just can't handle it...so they find any little way they can cut her down. I've never really understood the criticism against 'lighter/mainstream' fare anyway...It's usually something lighter that connects more universally with the masses to begin with. Not to mention, there is plenty of shitty indie/rock/alt stuff anyway. What matters is who's making it, where is it coming from, what kind of vision and soul is in the music, is there some sort of authenticity to it....Madonna's earlier work wouldn't be as timeless and beloved as it is if it didn't have all of that in its DNA. Oh, and as for comparisons to The Beatles, or Indie pop, or whatever the fuck else these 'non-mainstream/rocker/indie' fucks listen to...plenty of those artists have their "lightweight" fare too. Shit, The Beatles were the mainstream pop music of their day, and had TONS of lightweight tunes... Puta please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XXL Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Anyone who comes out with such pathetic ignorant arguments doesn't even deserve to be dignified with an answer. The answer is: there's nothing to disprove as there is zero merit to any claim Madonna is "lightweight" in any respect. She's written some pretty amazing songs, some more simple in structure/lyrics, others very intricate and evocative. Who's to define what is lightweight pop or not? Madonna's "lightweight" lyrics for her "simpler songs" (say Borderline) shit all over most pop artists entire discographies. Moreover a song can be simple and well-crafted, captivating and poignant at the same time. She has done so many genres, sounds, tempos and styles as VogueMusic has rightly reminded here, not everything applies to everything. As for "lighweight", what about The Look Of Love, High Society, Live To Tell, Like A Prayer, Waiting, Words, Mer Girl, SFH, most stuff from BS, ROL, Music, AL, COADF, Devil Wouldn't Recognise You, Falling Free. The list is endless, I have only one answer, 9 words: bye, come back when you've done your homework Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick00 Posted March 1, 2015 Share Posted March 1, 2015 Think M has a reasonable amount of light sounding pop songs, but they contrast well with her heavier, & deeper sounding tracks. Here in the states, the average person will know almost every M song up to Vogue & a few others between 1991 to 2015. Many people are not familiar with her non-single tracks which tend to be more interesting and display more depth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nefarious Posted March 1, 2015 Share Posted March 1, 2015 Her catalogue is so varied that I don't see how you can classify her as being any one thing. Some of her songs are deep and introspective, some provocative or intellectual, some are just impeccably-composed dance songs; there's a million more ways to describe and analyse her music. But lightweight pop? Madonna is lightweight pop if you have a lightweight brain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VogueMusic Posted March 1, 2015 Share Posted March 1, 2015 Madonna is lightweight pop if you have a lightweight brain. :clap: :clap: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larkspur Posted March 1, 2015 Share Posted March 1, 2015 Intelligent or deep songs? Just have them look up her discography. It will be much easier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larkspur Posted March 1, 2015 Share Posted March 1, 2015 Pop music for the most part I feel appeals to people's emotions but Madonna's success in music is the balance that she creates in her work. She doesn't look down on people's ability to think or have emotions. Some people do look down on and dismiss one over the other. Most of her songs I believe are a balance but there are a few that lean in one direction or the other. Unfortunality the ones that lean towards raw emotion are often the ones people dismiss or don't get. Those songs express pure emotion which sometimes human beings do and "there is nothing wrong with that!" Mental intelligence and emotional intelligence do not cancel each other out. They are of equal importance. I would "think" critics of Madonna are not always comfortable with her work going too far into something they repress or dismiss as unimportant. As a fan I love the balance in her work and my favorite songs have that balance with an edge on emotion. Her most universally loved songs I believe are a perfect balance. Take A Bow is a perfect example. Not overly complex and not overly emotional. The "majority" of people embrace all aspects of their personality which makes a song like this timeless and very relatable to most. Madonna is not dismissing of anything that creates the human experience. Philosophy, critical thinking, religion, imagination, love, desire, joy, sadness, anger....she embraces all of it. My idea of intelligence is embracing all of it, so that is why I push the majority of her discography as deep and intelligent as opposed to singling out a few. Is the idea of "deep and intelligent" mean void of emotion? My above thoughts are my take on deep and intelligent but I am curious what most people think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tvat Jens Posted March 1, 2015 Share Posted March 1, 2015 Never understood the snobbish attitude some people have to music... and I always try to ignore such people... not really worth wasting time and energy on ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larkspur Posted March 1, 2015 Share Posted March 1, 2015 Just examples of what "I" think represent a balance of deep and intelligent: Skin Rain Oh Father Mer Girl Live To Tell Let It Will Be Deeper and Deeper Isaac Frozen Rescue Me Not in that order and definitely not all of them. I just chose 10 out of my much longer list. I don't find many of Madonna's songs completely void of emotion but again I chose 10 songs out of a list that feel as if there is only an underlying emotion. Sanctuary Candy Perfume Girl Drowned World (substitute for love) Easy Ride Nobody's Perfect Paradise (not for me) Swim X Static Process Waiting Secret Garden It's also interesting what albums are held up in higher regard. Ray Of Light is the only album of hers where she stays serious (or "even" might be the better word) throughout. It embraces a thoughtful and emotional balance but recognizing that one can take over the other at any time. In the space of this album neither one does. Music does this to a lesser degree but not by much. "Amazing" leans towards pure emotion and it's interesting that it's not held as high in regard as the other songs. Erotica can get emotional. Confessions is pretty even although wanting to express emotions. Like A Prayer is Madonna's most purely Pop album. It's open and honest and has everything. All the albums have their own personalities and I would like to think about it more. Keep in mind that I haven't listed songs from Rebel Heart because I usually wait until the album is released to consider songs in making lists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5iVe Elements Posted March 1, 2015 Share Posted March 1, 2015 Just examples of what "I" think represent a balance of deep and intelligent: Skin Rain Oh Father Mer Girl Live To Tell Let It Will Be Deeper and Deeper Isaac Frozen Rescue Me Not in that order and definitely not all of them. I just chose 10 out of my much longer list. I don't find many of Madonna's songs completely void of emotion but again I chose 10 songs out of a list that feel as if there is only an underlying emotion. Sanctuary Candy Perfume Girl Drowned World (substitute for love) Easy Ride Nobody's Perfect Paradise (not for me) Swim X Static Process Waiting Secret Garden It's also interesting what albums are held up in higher regard. Ray Of Light is the only album of hers where she stays serious (or "even" might be the better word) throughout. It embraces a thoughtful and emotional balance but recognizing that one can take over the other at any time. In the space of this album neither one does. Music does this to a lesser degree but not by much. "Amazing" leans towards pure emotion and it's interesting that it's not held as high in regard as the other songs. Erotica can get emotional. Confessions is pretty even although wanting to express emotions. Like A Prayer is Madonna's most purely Pop album. It's open and honest and has everything. All the albums have their own personalities and I would like to think about it more. Keep in mind that I haven't listed songs from Rebel Heart because I usually wait until the album is released to consider songs in making lists. I love Amazing. It's brilliant and underrated! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest whatatramp Posted March 1, 2015 Share Posted March 1, 2015 whats with all these stupid threads lately? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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