Darren Hayes Interviews Rick Nowels

[Nightshade]

http://directory.libsyn.com/episode/index/id/2743116

The discussion about Madonna and Nowels starts around the 46:00 mark. It is quite fascinating as it discusses how they met and when they started writing together. Although it may have been reported previously, I never knew that "To Have and Not to Hold" was inspired by Astrud Gilberto who sang "The Girl from Ipanema". I hope Madonna incorporates more world music influences in her future music.

I love this background stuff and I wish we would get more of it.

[Mensch]

http://directory.libsyn.com/episode/index/id/2743116

The discussion about Madonna and Nowels starts around the 46:00 mark. It is quite fascinating as it discusses how they met and when they started writing together. Although it may have been reported previously, I never knew that "To Have and Not to Hold" was inspired by Astrud Gilberto who sang "The Girl from Ipanema". I hope Madonna incorporates more world music influences in her future music.

I love this background stuff and I wish we would get more of it.

Wow this was really a treat. So many artists I love and then the bit about Madonna being so incredible!!!!

[Vogue992]

http://directory.libsyn.com/episode/index/id/2743116

The discussion about Madonna and Nowels starts around the 46:00 mark. It is quite fascinating as it discusses how they met and when they started writing together. Although it may have been reported previously, I never knew that "To Have and Not to Hold" was inspired by Astrud Gilberto who sang "The Girl from Ipanema". I hope Madonna incorporates more world music influences in her future music.

I love this background stuff and I wish we would get more of it.

Thank you!

It's great to hear things like this and "To Have And Not To Hold" is one of my favorite songs ever

[MerGirl]

Thank you for posting this!

[Apples388]

The bossa nova influence in "To Have and Not to Hold" is very obvious in the demo version.

[peter]

Thank you so much for bringing this to our attention, Nightshade! This was indeed a treat to listen to the whole thing. Rick's career certainly is full of the stuff of legends. But I find Darren Hayes quite endearing, too. So interesting how the interview starts out with his recounting two very different phone calls -- one to Patrick Leonard and one to Rick Nowels. (And note how respectful Darren was about Patrick Leonard anyway, even though he was disappointed with the outcome.) More on that in a second, though.

The part about Madonna was wonderful, so deserved, and so encouraging to hear. And a fun little anecdote about his 'meet-cute' with Madonna. That really took courage.

I had no idea Nowels was involved with "Young and Beautiful." I was also unaware of Craig Armstrong's involvement (for Madonna fans, the string arranger on "Frozen") ... but then it made sense: Baz Luhrmann used Craig Armstrong for Moulin Rouge, I remember. [Odd aside: the film version of "Come What May" came on my iPod on shuffle the other day, and I was thinking about that song -- a great love song, and then recalled how Patrick Leonard was involved in that song ... and Marius DeVries was involved in that whole soundtrack for Moulin Rouge ... and Craig Armstrong, too. It was just a strange series of connections in my brain that involved so many Madonna collaborators. My brain wanted to explode.]

What was interesting to me about the comment about Patrick Leonard was that it left Darren cold ... and I have to admit, as wonderful as the things Pat has to say about Madonna in general are, and as important as he is to some of Madonna's classic musical monuments ... I don't know, I felt a little cold after reading that (great) Billboard article from Keith Caulfield yesterday. Keith is such a great person to interview anyone in relation to Madonna, and Pat wasn't disrespectful anywhere at all. Just a slight feeling I got in reading it ... like, he didn't watch Madonna's SuperBowl performance? Really? He just thinks it's great that she performed "Like a Prayer," because people told him she was performing it? Honestly, I get that he might not follow her every move nowadays, but ... the Super Bowl is something that -- Madonna or not -- is an American focal point. So I'd think, even if he doesn't normally watch it (like me), he might've checked it out simply because she was performing. I don't know. Call me weird for picking on that.

It just reminds me a bit of the interview they did with him in the VH1 Behind the Music featurette. Where he came across as sounding slightly resentful of all the button-pushing she did surrounding the record, because (as he put it) the music was "magical" and the controversies actually hindered people's enjoyment of the music. Or something to that effect. While he didn't sound angry, jaded, bitter over it, there was just a hint that he regrets the era didn't go differently. Which is valid for him, although obviously it isn't his decision ultimately. I don't know -- clearly it didn't ruin their relationship because she has worked with him quite a bit since then (unlike Bray). But I just find it interesting that Darren Hayes found the interaction cold, too -- because that's totally unrelated to Madonna. So maybe that's just a side to his personality, and not necessarily indicative of his feelings about Madonna particularly.

One thing I thought was sad was that Nowels cut off his friend because he became a "Jesus freak." I'm not quite sure I understand why it's so divisive for someone to be Christian or any other religion. Look at Madonna talking to Stuart Price in IGTTYAS -- they can have an honest conversation about faith without it coming to the point of conflict. They share their perspectives, and Madonna works to find a commonality. I think that's respectful and ... hopeful. If everyone just keeps saying they can't abide someone who is X, Y, or Z, we're just continuing to be separatists. I don't know. Just sad to hear someone say the friendship and partnership had to end because the other person was religious. Sometimes a person will marry someone with different religious beliefs! I guess it just depends on levels of tolerance. Maybe the other guy (Scott) was really pushy about his faith -- I'm not trying to judge Rick Nowels. It just made me sad to hear it.

On a positive note -- and somewhat disconnected from Madonna, but it can apply to her (personally, for me) -- I thought Darren's answer to his own question toward the end was really insightful/profound. The "what's the best part about being an artist?" -- and how he finds it satisfying to feel like he can look at someone else's art and feel like someone else sees the world the same as you. How people will thank him for saying something that they couldn't say. How it makes him feel like he's not alone out there in the universe. I thought that was a really interesting appreciation of his role and of the beauty of art. I find myself having that reaction to things -- like a film or a poem or a song (and that happens many times with Madonna songs) or a photo or a book -- where I actually feel a sense of relief. Not only that I am not completely alone in my feelings or viewpoint, but that ... the pressure is somehow lifted, oddly. I don't need to feel the pressure to express something or articulate something because Madonna, or Richard Blanco, or Amelie, or Call Me By Your Name, or The House of Sleep, or whoever/whatever it may be, has already expressed it so much more eloquently, sensitively, beautifully, or clearly than I could. Yeah. It's just a relief.

Anyway... I know this post is long, but ... the interview was over an hour, so I feel like it warrants a thorough response. Sorry if it offends anyone's eyeballs.

[Aime]

Great find! I used to be a major DH fan, but his last album left me cold and I find it hard to be a fan to someone who takes 4 years to come up with a record.

[Catboy]

The bossa nova influence in "To Have and Not to Hold" is very obvious in the demo version.

Do you have it?

[Jazzy Jan]

Peter, love reading your thoughts and interpretations. Always interesting and insightful.

[Pink Matter]

So there were about 9 great songs that didn't make Ray Of Light

[rb19]

So there were about 9 great songs that didn't make Ray Of Light

He said they wrote nine songs. As far as I know that includes Power Of Goodbye, To Have and Not To Hold, Little Star, Revenge, Like a Flower and Gone, Gone, Gone.

Does anyone have any info on the other two/three?

[Roland Barthes]

+ Alone again

[Mensch]

Thank you so much for bringing this to our attention, Nightshade! This was indeed a treat to listen to the whole thing. Rick's career certainly is full of the stuff of legends. But I find Darren Hayes quite endearing, too. So interesting how the interview starts out with his recounting two very different phone calls -- one to Patrick Leonard and one to Rick Nowels. (And note how respectful Darren was about Patrick Leonard anyway, even though he was disappointed with the outcome.) More on that in a second, though.

The part about Madonna was wonderful, so deserved, and so encouraging to hear. And a fun little anecdote about his 'meet-cute' with Madonna. That really took courage.

I had no idea Nowels was involved with "Young and Beautiful." I was also unaware of Craig Armstrong's involvement (for Madonna fans, the string arranger on "Frozen") ... but then it made sense: Baz Luhrmann used Craig Armstrong for Moulin Rouge, I remember. [Odd aside: the film version of "Come What May" came on my iPod on shuffle the other day, and I was thinking about that song -- a great love song, and then recalled how Patrick Leonard was involved in that song ... and Marius DeVries was involved in that whole soundtrack for Moulin Rouge ... and Craig Armstrong, too. It was just a strange series of connections in my brain that involved so many Madonna collaborators. My brain wanted to explode.]

What was interesting to me about the comment about Patrick Leonard was that it left Darren cold ... and I have to admit, as wonderful as the things Pat has to say about Madonna in general are, and as important as he is to some of Madonna's classic musical monuments ... I don't know, I felt a little cold after reading that (great) Billboard article from Keith Caulfield yesterday. Keith is such a great person to interview anyone in relation to Madonna, and Pat wasn't disrespectful anywhere at all. Just a slight feeling I got in reading it ... like, he didn't watch Madonna's SuperBowl performance? Really? He just thinks it's great that she performed "Like a Prayer," because people told him she was performing it? Honestly, I get that he might not follow her every move nowadays, but ... the Super Bowl is something that -- Madonna or not -- is an American focal point. So I'd think, even if he doesn't normally watch it (like me), he might've checked it out simply because she was performing. I don't know. Call me weird for picking on that.

It just reminds me a bit of the interview they did with him in the VH1 Behind the Music featurette. Where he came across as sounding slightly resentful of all the button-pushing she did surrounding the record, because (as he put it) the music was "magical" and the controversies actually hindered people's enjoyment of the music. Or something to that effect. While he didn't sound angry, jaded, bitter over it, there was just a hint that he regrets the era didn't go differently. Which is valid for him, although obviously it isn't his decision ultimately. I don't know -- clearly it didn't ruin their relationship because she has worked with him quite a bit since then (unlike Bray). But I just find it interesting that Darren Hayes found the interaction cold, too -- because that's totally unrelated to Madonna. So maybe that's just a side to his personality, and not necessarily indicative of his feelings about Madonna particularly.

One thing I thought was sad was that Nowels cut off his friend because he became a "Jesus freak." I'm not quite sure I understand why it's so divisive for someone to be Christian or any other religion. Look at Madonna talking to Stuart Price in IGTTYAS -- they can have an honest conversation about faith without it coming to the point of conflict. They share their perspectives, and Madonna works to find a commonality. I think that's respectful and ... hopeful. If everyone just keeps saying they can't abide someone who is X, Y, or Z, we're just continuing to be separatists. I don't know. Just sad to hear someone say the friendship and partnership had to end because the other person was religious. Sometimes a person will marry someone with different religious beliefs! I guess it just depends on levels of tolerance. Maybe the other guy (Scott) was really pushy about his faith -- I'm not trying to judge Rick Nowels. It just made me sad to hear it.

On a positive note -- and somewhat disconnected from Madonna, but it can apply to her (personally, for me) -- I thought Darren's answer to his own question toward the end was really insightful/profound. The "what's the best part about being an artist?" -- and how he finds it satisfying to feel like he can look at someone else's art and feel like someone else sees the world the same as you. How people will thank him for saying something that they couldn't say. How it makes him feel like he's not alone out there in the universe. I thought that was a really interesting appreciation of his role and of the beauty of art. I find myself having that reaction to things -- like a film or a poem or a song (and that happens many times with Madonna songs) or a photo or a book -- where I actually feel a sense of relief. Not only that I am not completely alone in my feelings or viewpoint, but that ... the pressure is somehow lifted, oddly. I don't need to feel the pressure to express something or articulate something because Madonna, or Richard Blanco, or Amelie, or Call Me By Your Name, or The House of Sleep, or whoever/whatever it may be, has already expressed it so much more eloquently, sensitively, beautifully, or clearly than I could. Yeah. It's just a relief.

Anyway... I know this post is long, but ... the interview was over an hour, so I feel like it warrants a thorough response. Sorry if it offends anyone's eyeballs.

Agree on many points. I did KIND of get a little tiny bit bothered by the whole not watching the Super Bowl bit...almost like he was trying to take it back by saying he "might've" watched it online..what?!

Anyway the interview was what I'm all passionate about. Darren Hayes is very much like me if I were somewhere in the realms of pop culture...I'd be so grateful and passionate about the great work these songwriters and people like Madonna and Dido have created.

I love listening to these stories and how they evolved into these beautiful records. There's really nothing like it (for me, personally...as a music fan ad someone who tries to write music).

I don't know if anyone caught it but there was a special on Blondie on the Smithsonian channel called "Blondie's New York" and it was just an hour and a small moment in their long career but it was very musical in describing how these infamous songs came about. I WISH. I DREAM one day Madonna would take part in such a special. I'd even love other artists like Dido and Stevie Nicks etc...to do them. It's really great to here how these specific ICONIC guitar riffs came about...how the melody or the lyrics came to mind and what inspired it, how the band used specific equipment to generate that exact sound and where they were at the time.

[MerGirl]

I just love to hear Madonna getting praise for her songwriting, and from actual songwriters. She has made some amazing music throughout the decades, and has been very consistent quality wise.

Anyway, I don't know why I wasn't aware of the fact that Rick Nowels has worked with some other of my favorite artists, like Lana, Lykke Li and Marina.

He has been involved with (besides the Madonna songs) some of my favorite songs:

Summertime Sadness, Cola, Body Electric, Young and Beautiful (Lana)

I Follow Rivers, Sadness Is A Blessing (Lykke Li) and some of my favorite songs from Marina's Elektra Heart.

I hope Madonna works with him again.

[Mad_On_Her]

I find Darren Hayes to be nauseating just his whole manner it's so wanky. And about Pat Leonard, I don't think Pat was ever that close to Madonna. They worked together and would have been friends but not really close. I don't picture him being a big Madonna fan like most people Madonna has worked with

[peter]

I just love to hear Madonna getting praise for her songwriting, and from actual songwriters. She has made some amazing music throughout the decades, and has been very consistent quality wise.

Anyway, I don't know why I wasn't aware of the fact that Rick Nowels has worked with some other of my favorite artists, like Lana, Lykke Li and Marina.

I wasn't aware of any of that, either, and I had the same thought ... I'm wondering if the digital age has caused some of this lack of awareness? If we don't get the album liner notes anymore like we used to, it's harder to know all those details. (Of course, it's 'easier' to find in a way, too, since we have Google and Wikipedia -- some people have access to ASCAP etc. -- but you still have to search it out. Whereas, in the past, if you bought a single, it was on the packaging. If you download a single now, you don't have that info immediately, you have to go find it yourself.)

[Guest Rachelle of London]

If you tweet Rick he answers almost all tweets! To Have and Not To Hold is one of my fave songs and he said he loves it too. He told me that writing that with M was a highlight as they explored so many layers and depths. He sounds like a cool guy! You hear the Ipanema influence more on the demo as Suedey has said. My fave version!

Rick Nowels is a legend. I'm a fan of stuff he's done with others. I would love for M to work with him again!

[Jazzy Jan]

If you tweet Rick he answers almost all tweets! To Have and Not To Hold is one of my fave songs and he said he loves it too. He told me that writing that with M was a highlight as they explored so many layers and depths. He sounds like a cool guy! You hear the Ipanema influence more on the demo as Suedey has said. My fave version!

Rick Nowels is a legend. I'm a fan of stuff he's done with others. I would love for M to work with him again!

Chelle, he sounds lovely. I also love the songs he wrote with Belinda Carlisle and Stevie Nicks amongst others.