I have come to love the album version of...this much-maligned song

[material_boy]

Do you know what vocabulary is? Your appropriation of the word suggests that you don't. Then again, you seem to be rather simple.

1) Guy Oseary asked the fans via twitter for input on the track listing.

2) There was no new campaign shot specifically for celebration. Instead a collage was created. As you are such a clever boy I'm sure you can spot the difference between the IC booklet and the Celebration booklet.

3) The different purchase options available show how it was designed as a way to accrue as much monetary profit as possible. There was an iTunes special edition. There was a video edition with VIDEOS WHICH HADN'T BEEN ON DVD BEFORE. Then there were two different disc versions. Certain tracks were available on different editions.

You have to be stupid not to realise that Warner were maximising their investment while they could.

If Madonna had a solid vision it would have appeared as such.

4) This is nothing to do with quality or my personal opinion of the project. I loved Celebration and I adored the new songs.

5) When artists sign record deals they are kept to the promise very tightly and if they don't keep that promise they receive a lot of issues. Just ask George Michael. Madonna was fulfilling her contractual obligation. This was nothing to do with her personal vision.

6) Evidence doesn't just come from the repeated word of others. If Liz Rosenburg said Madonna ate fifty pizzas a week would you believe it? If it was written in a newspaper that Madonna said her favourite song of all time was 'What does the fox say?' would you believe that too? The EVIDENCE is the work itself. Maybe you should look a bit deeper.

The "I'm rubber and you're glue" comeback is very creative. Well done. eyeroll

As for the rest, you seem to spiraling into a rant that's divorced from your original point. The only thing that I disagree with -- and what bluejean, whoopiedoo and others have objected to in the comments above -- is your original claim: That Madonna had "very little to do with the tracklisting of Celebration" and "less so" for "GHV2" than for "Immaculate." (See: Your own comments above, timestamped 05:28 PM and 05:55 PM.)

There is evidence that she was heavily involved in the development of "GHV2"'s tracklisting, including choosing not to record any new tracks for it. (See: BBC and NBC interviews, among others.)

There is nothing to suggest that she had "very little" involvement for the tracklisting of "Celebration." And, if we're going to speculate (which is still what you're doing here), one could say that the omission of major hits like "True Blue" and "American Pie" suggests that she had great involvement in the tracklisting, as the record label would be be incentivized to include those songs over flops and minor hits like "Everybody" and "Hollywood."

So, if you have something -- anything, really -- to prove your point, other than your divining, please post it here.

[Guest]

madonna specifically said in a live interview that the songs for celebration were random and drawn out of a hat and she has zero input on the selection.

[Guest]

The "I'm rubber and you're glue" comeback is very creative. Well done. eyeroll

As for the rest, you seem to spiraling into a rant that's divorced from your original point. The only thing that I disagree with -- and what bluejean, whoopiedoo and others have objected to in the comments above -- is your original claim: That Madonna had "very little to do with the tracklisting of Celebration" and "less so" for "GHV2" than for "Immaculate." (See: Your own comments above, timestamped 05:28 PM and 05:55 PM.)

There is evidence that she was heavily involved in the development of "GHV2"'s tracklisting, including choosing not to record any new tracks for it. (See: BBC and NBC interviews, among others.)

There is nothing to suggest that she had "very little" involvement for the tracklisting of "Celebration." And, if we're going to speculate (which is still what you're doing here), one could say that the omission of major hits like "True Blue" and "American Pie" suggests that she had great involvement in the tracklisting, as the record label would be be incentivized to include those songs over flops and minor hits like "Everybody" and "Hollywood."

So, if you have something -- anything, really -- to prove your point, other than your divining, please post it here.

Ever heard of royalty shares?

I think it's hilarious beyond belief that you're suggesting the fact that Madonna stated that she chose NOT TO RECORD NEW SONGS for GHV2 prove how she was really involved in the project. I've heard it all now.

[Guest]

madonna specifically said in a live interview that the songs for celebration were random and drawn out of a hat and she has zero input on the selection.

Of course! Why WOULDN'T Madonna say something like that on TV? Now, what did I do with that link?

[material_boy]

Ever heard of royalty shares?

I think it's hilarious beyond belief that you're suggesting the fact that Madonna stated that she chose NOT TO RECORD NEW SONGS for GHV2 prove how she was really involved in the project. I've heard it all now.

So you have nothing to back up your original claim. Noted.

[Guest bluejean]

You're making an assumption here without providing any evidence to back you up, and you're at least half wrong. There are many interviews from 2001 which suggest she was heavily involved with "GHV2"'s development:

• She said that she chose all tracks to appear on the collection
• She stated that it was her decision to not include a new song
• She specifically stated that it was her decision to not include "American Pie"
• She said she went through many working titles before settling on "GHV2"
• She said that she approved the timing of its release because it felt like a good capstone to the year, as she'd just finished the tour

So the idea that she wasn't involved with "GHV2" is incorrect, unless you think she was lying to Jo Whiley, Matt Lauer, and everyone else who interviewed her about it.

Exactly. She also said that she listened to many song numerous times over and to help her decide which ones were strong enough to make the collection. They asked her specifically why songs like 'Fever' were excluded.

[Guest bluejean]

those are not major hits anyway

i think celebration was great

Hollywood was there instead of AL and Miles away was her last single i guess

True Blue was a UK #1, Playground was a US #1, I'll Remember is one of her biggest hits in the US ever and stayed at #2 for ages. You'll See and Deeper and Deeper were top 10 hits. Conversely Miles Away didn't really chart anywhere apart from Japan and Hollywood, although a reasonably big hit in the UK was less successful than all the aforementioned.

[Crystal Coffin]

So why "Fever" was excluded I mean, what did she answer exactly, of course it's not her song.

[Guest bluejean]

Ever heard of royalty shares?

I think it's hilarious beyond belief that you're suggesting the fact that Madonna stated that she chose NOT TO RECORD NEW SONGS for GHV2 prove how she was really involved in the project. I've heard it all now.

Quite abit like discussing the artwork of celebration as evidence she wasn't involved in selecting the track listing

[Guest bluejean]

So why "Fever" was excluded I mean, what did she answer exactly, of course it's not her song.

I can't remember word for word but they asked her why certain songs weren't included and 'Fever' was one of the ones listed. She basically said they listened to potential songs numerous times in a row to determine whether they were strong enough to include and the hit singles left off weren't considered strong enough.

She also said American Pie was left off because a certain record exec twisted her arm to include it on Music as a bonus track, and that she regretted doing that. So she was punishing it as a result by not including it on GHV2.

[Guest bluejean]

Let's be honest, regardless of contractual obligations Madonna is hardly going to put out any project without overseeing and approving the final product. She's not Britney Spears.

She WAS busy when Celebration was put together but she still found the time to record new songs and film a video. We have no reason to think she had little to do with choosing the track listing. That would be very unlike her.

In saying that, I don't think that track listing is necessarily how she would have wanted it if it were entirely up to her. It was a project put together with the fans in mind. But we can be certain Madonna made all the final decisions and was heavily involved.

[ryan]

You've got of a lot of things going on at the moment, one of them is your best of 'GHV 2,' why that title?
Because it's to the point. We went through catchy titles, funny titles and witty titles and things like that, but at the end of the day I thought it was really modern and succinct and to the point.

And how did you get through the process of deciding which tracks were on there?
Listening to stuff over and over again. A lot of my old songs make me sick

So hold on, which ones are not on there?
I'm not telling you!

'This Used to Be My Playground' that's not on there. 'Fever' is not on there...
Oh, I like 'Fever' alright. But the thing is they had to have listening power for me. I had to be able to listen to them five times in a row and think this is really good, this is a well written song, it's really well produced. I can honestly say not all my songs have been, some are better than others, that's all there is to it. So the ones that I thought really stood the test of time, in terms of well written, well produced, well sung, those are the ones that made it.

'American Pie' is not on there, what was the reason for that?
The reason why is because I ended up putting it on my album, 'Music', at the end. It was sort of one of those things, a certain record company executive twisted my arm into doing, we won't name any names. My gut told me not to do it, and I did it and then I regretted it so just for that reason it didn't deserve to get on 'GHV2'.

You regretted doing the song?
No not at all. But it didn't really belong on my album, but I did it and therefore it's being punished, it's not allowed on GHV2

Why did you decide to put the album out anyway, was it a record company decision or was it 'I've reached that time in my life, I'll put another one greatest hits out?'
It was really like a mark for the end of the year. It went part and parcel with the tour. The tour was pretty much a celebration of my last 3 records and what I've been doing since I did Evita.

And why did you not put another single on there or record a new single?
Because it says greatest hits

But it could have been a greatest hit.
Well I'm gonna save that for my next record which I'm gonna start recording in January.

So you are about to do some new stuff?
Yeah.

But all the papers were saying that's it, you've stopped now?
Oh, since when did you believe all the papers?

Have you got ideas who you're working with on the next album?
Yes, I'm working with Mirwais again ...

That was a genius stroke.
Yeah, he's so great. So I'm gonna work with him again. I might work with this guy that I met when I was looking for some musicians to play with. His name is Stuart Price, he's in a group called Les Rythmes Digitales. We fooled around with re mixes and re doing a lot of the tracks for the actual live show. Then we talked about working on stuff for my next album, and he's already working on music for me. So I'm going to try that collaboration as well.

[rayofmusic]

She chose all the songs for GHV2, she specifically stated that the songs that made the final tracklist were the ones she could listen to for more than 3 times in a row and still hold up on their own

[Guest]

So you have nothing to back up your original claim. Noted.

Neither do you hunty! So just pack your bags and move out.

Quite abit like discussing the artwork of celebration as evidence she wasn't involved in selecting the track listing

I'm using it as an example of how she wasn't AS INVOLVED IN THE MOTHERFUCKING PROJECT!!! What is wrong with you people?

Let's be honest, regardless of contractual obligations Madonna is hardly going to put out any project without overseeing and approving the final product. She's not Britney Spears.

She WAS busy when Celebration was put together but she still found the time to record new songs and film a video. We have no reason to think she had little to do with choosing the track listing. That would be very unlike her.

In saying that, I don't think that track listing is necessarily how she would have wanted it if it were entirely up to her. It was a project put together with the fans in mind. But we can be certain Madonna made all the final decisions and was heavily involved.

I love how you just contradicted yourself. Madonna is a Leo. She's powerful and opinionated and creative. However, she NEEDED a record label to get where she got. Why do you think she was so determined in the 80's to get signed to one? Record labels hold a lot of power over the artist and that's why people who rely on touring have tried other ways to distribute their records. Seriously, you people need to let go of the emotional and see the logic!

[Guest bluejean]

Neither do you hunty! So just pack your bags and move out.

I'm using it as an example of how she wasn't AS INVOLVED IN THE MOTHERFUCKING PROJECT!!! What is wrong with you people?

I love how you just contradicted yourself. Madonna is a Leo. She's powerful and opinionated and creative. However, she NEEDED a record label to get where she got. Why do you think she was so determined in the 80's to get signed to one? Record labels hold a lot of power over the artist and that's why people who rely on touring have tried other ways to distribute their records. Seriously, you people need to let go of the emotional and see the logic!

I didn't contradict myself. The track listing was put together as a best of, not Madonna's personal favourites songs. There is ZERO evidence nor logic to your claim she wasn't involved in choosing the track list though. You just made that up and now you're trying to pass it off as "logic" because you have no real basis for your opinion. Jesus.

[Guest]

I didn't contradict myself. The track listing was put together as a best of, not Madonna's personal favourites songs. There is ZERO evidence nor logic to your claim she wasn't involved in choosing the track list though. You just made that up and now you're trying to pass it off as "logic" because you have no real basis for your opinion. Jesus.

Darlink, please. If it was chosen based on what the public wanted it is not MADONNA doing the choosing is it? She probably was MORE hands on with GHV2 than she was with Celebration. My point is that with each compilation release she has been less involved. Her involvement with Celebration was small, let's be honest. She did what she enjoyed doing which is writing/recording music. I can self assuredly say that making a film and touring are her main priorities. Not the tracklisting of a record label cash in.

[BangGangUK]

Neither do you hunty! So just pack your bags and move out.

I'm using it as an example of how she wasn't AS INVOLVED IN THE MOTHERFUCKING PROJECT!!! What is wrong with you people?

I love how you just contradicted yourself. Madonna is a Leo. She's powerful and opinionated and creative. However, she NEEDED a record label to get where she got. Why do you think she was so determined in the 80's to get signed to one? Record labels hold a lot of power over the artist and that's why people who rely on touring have tried other ways to distribute their records. Seriously, you people need to let go of the emotional and see the logic!

Astrology is bullshit.

Give it up.. M had plenty of input in Celebration.

Back on topic, the album version of this song is spectacular.

Edited December 9, 2013 by BangGangUK

[Guest]

Yes, Madonna has plenty of involvement in Celebration.

She also has her dressing room sanitised in order to remove all of her DNA.

She also is a real bitch and is horrible to all human beings who cross her path.

I mean...seriously.

[Pink Matter]

^ I shall let my avi do the talking GU :-)

[Guest bluejean]

Darlink, please. If it was chosen based on what the public wanted it is not MADONNA doing the choosing is it?

Who else would decide the public wanted Miles Away?

[Guest]

Who else would decide the public wanted Miles Away?

There's something called MARKET DIVERSITY. It's a very powerful selling tool and of course with a compilation it's key.

[material_boy]

There's something called MARKET DIVERSITY. It's a very powerful selling tool and of course with a compilation it's key.

Oh my God. Is this kid for f-ing real?

[Guest bluejean]

There's something called ARGUING FOR THE SAKE OF IT even when you have nothing to back up your claim. It's very irritating and of course with Gugu it's constant.

[material_boy]

Ugh. How awful -- and sad.

Back to the topic at hand here -- I listened to "American Life" for the time in ages. And I have to admit... I didn't hate this song as much as I used to.

[Guest]

Ugh. How awful -- and sad.

Back to the topic at hand here -- I listened to "American Life" for the time in ages. And I have to admit... I didn't hate this song as much as I used to.

Wow. What insight to the universe. Now I know why you feel qualified to judge me.

Stupid bitch. Don't cross my path unless you have something worthwhile to say.

[Guest]

There's something called ARGUING FOR THE SAKE OF IT even when you have nothing to back up your claim. It's very irritating and of course with Gugu it's constant.

I'm not arguing for the sake of it. I just don't live in a nuclear shelter. If you meet Madonna ask her what track seven is on Celebration and watch her response. Ask her for a synopsis of W.E and it will be a very different answer...

[ryan]

Ugh. How awful -- and sad.

Back to the topic at hand here -- I listened to "American Life" for the time in ages. And I have to admit... I didn't hate this song as much as I used to.

Welcome to the forum!!!!!! :hugs: <3

And I just adore the song btw, the acoustic bits are so lush. I love the melody during those parts. It would be cool if there was a version that was strictly acoustic.

[Genevieve Vavance]

Is this the same Material boy from Madonnamad? !!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Guest]

Welcome to the forum!!!!!! :hugs: <3

Why do you pretend like you're above it all when I can actually think of many examples of you being two faced and bitchy?

[material_boy]

Is this the same Material boy from Madonnamad? !!!!!!!!!!!!!

Not the same material_boy. I've been posting on here since Reinvention era, IIRC. I've been pretty on and off -- popping in regularly for a while and then disappearing for months.

My comment counter was reset at some point. I feel so young being back in triple digits...