Coronavirus

[Nick]

I went to the local supermarket a couple of hours ago. It was literally ten times more crowded than usual. 

[realityisalways]

12 hours ago, Msig said:

The Danish government has announced an almost complete lockdown of the public sector for the next two weeks:

• All non-essential employees in the public sector should work from home for the next two weeks. If their jobs don't allow them to work from home, they will given paid leave. 
• All public daycare facilities, schools, universities, cultural institutions, libraries and indoor leisure facilities will be closed for two weeks.
• Companies are encouraged to ensure that as many people as possible work from home or take leave.
• All religious institutions and associations have been encouraged to stay closed.
• Restaurants, cafés and bars etc. have been encouraged to stay closed.
• All planned procedures in the public health care sector have been put on hold.
• All indoor gatherings involving more than 100 people will be banned.

Basically what every government should be doing right now 

[Bill]

41 minutes ago, Nick said:

I went to the local supermarket a couple of hours ago. It was literally ten times more crowded than usual. 

Same. It’s scary out there honestly.  It hasn’t even hit my county yet as far as we know but the shelves are bare and it’s total chaos.

[Django]

16 hours ago, XXL said:

 

Totally agree

And a right that comes at a price anyway

You pay taxes for it

 

Just like you pay taxes to have a public school system, to have roads etc. If someone wants to pay more to get the luxury fast treatment is fine but EVERYONE should be entitled to basic healthcare, regardless of income, especially in situations like this one

 

Actually, I still think that private healthcare and education should be illegal everywhere. Those are serious matters. Just as an example, if you have money you can buy yourself a 1 million dollar car while an average person can afford a second hand economic car. Both eventually take u to the same place, just one is more fancy than the other. On the other hand, healthcare and education should be EQUAL for everyone. Elites should actually mingle with the common people in those two areas, cause eventually most of this people end in positions of power. If they grow up surrounded by reality maybe they would act less psychopathically than they do now. And since they wold have no choice, they maybe would assure the public systems works as it should be. It may sound radical and utopian, but given that the current "neoliberalist" and capitalist system is blatantly failing to achieve common wellbeing, radical and utopian measures need to be done. it's not like we have other choices. It isn't only the current corona virus crisis but the following economic crisis, inequality (gender, sexuality, race, poverty...) and more importantly: THE ENVIRONMENT. The current system is crashing and it's not gonna be pretty, but maybe it's the chance to start something new, learn from mistakes and wake the fuck up for once. Again, I may sound utopian but we are fucked if we continue like this. It may be even too late at this point.

Society must work together, not compete. 

[realityisalways]

Whatsapp audio from Spanish Nurse 

2 minutes ago, Django said:

 

Actually, I still think that private healthcare and education should be illegal everywhere. Those are serious matters. Just as an example, if you have money you can buy yourself a 1 million dollar car while an average person can afford a second hand economic car. Both eventually take u to the same place, just one is more fancy than the other. On the other hand, healthcare and education should be EQUAL for everyone. Elites should actually mingle with the common people in those two areas, cause eventually most of this people end in positions of power. If they grow up surrounded by reality maybe they would act less psychopathically than they do now. And since they wold have no choice, they maybe would assure the public systems works as it should be. It may sound radical and utopian, but given that the current "neoliberalist" and capitalist system is blatantly failing to achieve common wellbeing, radical and utopian measures need to be done. it's not like we have other choices. It isn't only the current corona virus crisis but the following economic crisis, inequality (gender, sexuality, race, poverty...) and more importantly: THE ENVIRONMENT. The current system is crashing and it's not gonna be pretty, but maybe it's the chance to start something new, learn from mistakes and wake the fuck up for once. Again, I may sound utopian but we are fucked if we continue like this. It may be even too late at this point.

 I agree the world we knew is gone and we are entering a new reality. I just hope it is even as half as utopic as we need and not dystopic. 

[XXL]

2 hours ago, rebelvvv said:

No government will tell you the truth though as western democracies such as Italy start to ramp up, it can't be hidden any more and will be obvious. Two weeks ago Italy had 159 cases, and they've been taking FAR more draconian measures than anyone else and even banned visitors from China early on.

.......... but the fact is that whatever we think, China dumped all its economic resources and medical professionals to tackle 1% of its population in the crisis center to get even its published mortality rate as low as it was (and still 24x as deadly as the common flu).  This isn't something to just think will go away without everyone doing their part to avoid it as much as possible.

 

Amen

But no, the US and distant cousin (previously Master) UK governments always have to "distinguish" themselves from the rest of the pack

Talk about holier than thou when in fact it's probably quite the opposite in MANY respects

Is God blessing "America" or is it actually cursing it thanks to its ruthless, abusive, incompetent, ignorant, manipulative, kindergarten political class?

It is time we the people pulled together and started questioning things rather than taking it all at face value, and this goes for anybody anywhere, not just America

[XXL]

6 hours ago, karbatal said:

Spain is in super red alert. Even weddings are cancelled by law! 

Most Chinese businesses are closed "on holiday". Rumor says they went to China because they didn't trust Spanish measures . I hope it's a fake rumor. I can't imagine Chinese health system being better tbqh.

 

Apparently Madrid is en route to lockdown mode as well

[XXL]

 

 

 

[Camacho]

It’s getting worse each day at my Whole Foods. They have massively increased stock shipments and staffing there (with everyone doing overtime) but it’s not enough and the place is left very bare each day. 

 

 

 

[XXL]

[rebelvvv]

12 minutes ago, XXL said:

Amen

But no, the US and distant cousin (previously Master) UK governments always have to "distinguish" themselves from the rest of the pack

Talk about holier than thou when in fact it's probably quite the opposite in MANY respects

Is God blessing "America" or is it actually cursing it thanks to its ruthless, abusive, incompetent, ignorant, manipulative, kindergarten political class?

It is time we the people pulled together and started questioning things rather than taking it all at face value, and this goes for anybody anywhere, not just America

This isn't really the time to bring politics into things. The point is people should learn to exercise their basic common sense and logical thinking and make their own judgments, regardless of what the governments/politicians or mainstream media try to tell you.  The former has to understate things or there would be total anarchy in a democracy (and violence and riots, cause remember, Americans have guns) and the latter has whipped up hysteria over so many issues and non-issues, most people don't have the attention span to care any more.  Clickbait journalism and oversensationalism of all topics has basically led to them crying wolf.

If you actually read between the lines, the CDC and health professionals/scientists have been telling people to prepare and take precautions for WEEKS now, when it was the time to do it, not when everyone is now all freaked out at an "official" pandemic label and cleaning out the stores.  You can't help people who won't help themselves or think someone else is just going to take care of them or this will all just go away while they go on living their normal lives.  It's Darwinism at work.

Now that it's the real thing, just use your own eyes.  Photos don't lie.  When was the last time you saw ANYONE wearing hazmat gear for "just the flu"?!  They didn't even do that for SARS which had a much higher published mortality rate.  That alone should have told you that the "news" coming out of China was obviously not the reality.  Now that we have a better idea of what reality is thanks to Italy, it may be too late.

Younger people SHOULD care even if they are at low risk of dying because it's cratering the economy and is going to lead to massive unemployment, small businesses going out of business for good, and disrupting all of our lives the more this is prolonged or out of control, especially if the healthcare system collapses.

[XXL]

1 minute ago, rebelvvv said:

This isn't really the time to bring politics into things. The point is people should learn to exercise their basic common sense and logical thinking and make their own judgments, regardless of what the governments/politicians or mainstream media try to tell you.  The former has to understate things or there would be total anarchy in a democracy (and violence and riots, cause remember, Americans have guns) and the latter has whipped up hysteria over so many issues and non-issues, most people don't have the attention span to care any more.  Clickbait journalism and oversensationalism of all topics has basically led to them crying wolf.

If you actually read between the lines, the CDC and health professionals/scientists have been telling people to prepare and take precautions for WEEKS now, when it was the time to do it, not when everyone is now all freaked out at an "official" pandemic label and cleaning out the stores.  You can't help people who won't help themselves or think someone else is just going to take care of them or this will all just go away while they go on living their normal lives.  It's Darwinism at work.

Now that it's the real thing, just use your own eyes.  Photos don't lie.  When was the last time you saw ANYONE wearing hazmat gear for "just the flu"?!  They didn't even do that for SARS which had a much higher published mortality rate.  That alone should have told you that the "news" coming out of China was obviously not the reality.  Now that we have a better idea of what reality is thanks to Italy, it may be too late.

Younger people SHOULD care even if they are at low risk of dying because it's cratering the economy and is going to lead to massive unemployment, small businesses going out of business for good, and disrupting all of our lives the more this is prolonged or out of control, especially if the healthcare system collapses.

 

I agree with everything you wrote except the first sentence. Politics and a different cultural frame have many things to do with it. Politics not in the sense of Right or Left but in the sense of how Western leadership deals with this type of things. And yes the UK and the US governments are distinguishing themselves for dealing with it rather poorly to say the least, compared to most of the rest of the Western world

Everything else you wrote I subscribe to

[rebelvvv]

Just now, XXL said:

I agree with everything you wrote except the first sentence. Politics and a different cultural frame have many things to do with it. Politics not in the sense of Right or Left but in the sense of how Western leadership deals with this type of things. And yes the UK and the US governments are distinguishing themselves for dealing with it rather poorly to say the least, compared to most of the rest of the Western world

Everything else you wrote I subscribe to

I agree with the different cultural frame, but you have to understand that Americans in general also have a different cultural frame, not just the politicians.  Fact is, most people aren't going to just listen to what they're told no matter what.  Westerners in general just don't have the hygiene paranoia of Asians nor respect for authority and following rules and the same measures just will not work the same way everywhere.  You can't even lump all Europeans together the same way, which is why every country and the UK are responding differently.  It is what it is.  All we can do is the best we can with where we live.

[XXL]

4 minutes ago, rebelvvv said:

I agree with the different cultural frame, but you have to understand that Americans in general also have a different cultural frame, not just the politicians.  Fact is, most people aren't going to just listen to what they're told no matter what.  Westerners in general just don't have the hygiene paranoia of Asians nor respect for authority and following rules and the same measures just will not work the same way everywhere.  You can't even lump all Europeans together the same way, which is why every country and the UK are responding differently.  It is what it is.  All we can do is the best we can with where we live.

 

[rebelvvv]

https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/epgkb7/if-your-aging-parents-are-ignoring-coronavirus-risks-youre-not-alone

I mean we've had 3 major cruise ships with issues and people STILL can't get through their heads that they shouldn't go on cruise ships because they are petri dishes for epidemics and pandemics.  Old people/adults literally had to be told this.  It's a whole overprivileged attitude of "I can do whatever I want", "it's no big deal" and "obviously it will just affect everyone but me" mentality that is pervasive.  Instead, people's continued selfish actions cause more and more people to have to become exposed and to rescue them when things go wrong.  Same applies to young people who just decide to take advantage of cheap spring break travel and airfare during this crisis to GO TO EUROPE and bring even more infections back by the day.

[XXL]

1 hour ago, Django said:

 

Actually, I still think that private healthcare and education should be illegal everywhere. Those are serious matters. Just as an example, if you have money you can buy yourself a 1 million dollar car while an average person can afford a second hand economic car. Both eventually take u to the same place, just one is more fancy than the other. On the other hand, healthcare and education should be EQUAL for everyone. Elites should actually mingle with the common people in those two areas, cause eventually most of this people end in positions of power. If they grow up surrounded by reality maybe they would act less psychopathically than they do now. And since they wold have no choice, they maybe would assure the public systems works as it should be. It may sound radical and utopian, but given that the current "neoliberalist" and capitalist system is blatantly failing to achieve common wellbeing, radical and utopian measures need to be done. it's not like we have other choices. It isn't only the current corona virus crisis but the following economic crisis, inequality (gender, sexuality, race, poverty...) and more importantly: THE ENVIRONMENT. The current system is crashing and it's not gonna be pretty, but maybe it's the chance to start something new, learn from mistakes and wake the fuck up for once. Again, I may sound utopian but we are fucked if we continue like this. It may be even too late at this point.

Society must work together, not compete. 

 

It is very difficult to organise and to set the rules for organising such thing and make it less dictatorship like than any other neoliberal system. Two faces of the same coin. This is what Marx was preaching yet he lived very comfortably in London mingling with British aristocracy. As noble an idea as it is it's also highly utopic and hard to establish. I'm not saying I'm against it, hope you understand what I mean. Egualitarian experiments gone wrong: bloodbath and dictatorship just the same

[XXL]

6 minutes ago, rebelvvv said:

https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/epgkb7/if-your-aging-parents-are-ignoring-coronavirus-risks-youre-not-alone

I mean we've had 3 major cruise ships with issues and people STILL can't get through their heads that they shouldn't go on cruise ships because they are petri dishes for epidemics and pandemics.  Old people/adults literally had to be told this.  It's a whole overprivileged attitude of "I can do whatever I want", "it's no big deal" and "obviously it will just affect everyone but me" mentality that is pervasive.  Instead, people's continued selfish actions cause more and more people to have to become exposed and to rescue them when things go wrong.  Same applies to young people who just decide to take advantage of cheap spring break travel and airfare during this crisis to GO TO EUROPE and bring even more infections back by the day.

 

This 

[XXL]

32 minutes ago, I Don’t Search I Find said:

It’s getting worse each day at my Whole Foods. They have massively increased stock shipments and staffing there (with everyone doing overtime) but it’s not enough and the place is left very bare each day. 

 

 

 

 

This is exactly what I meant

What would they do then if it gets to the seriousness of the Italian situation if they are acting like this now??

[XXL]

 

 

 

[Django]

3 minutes ago, XXL said:

 

It is very difficult to organise and to set the rules for organising such thing and make it less dictatorship like than any other neoliberal system. Two faces of the same coin. This is what Marx was preaching yet he lived very comfortably in London mingling with British aristocracy. As noble an idea as it is it's also highly utopic and hard to establish. I'm not saying I'm against it, hope you understand what I mean. Egualitarian experiments gone wrong: bloodbath and dictatorship just the same

 

Well, you have to have the basics covered in order to have time to theorize and rationalize about these things. If your daily problem is how you are gonna get to eat that day, you don't really have time to sit down and think about it.

 

I agree that the theories on paper sound better than what came out in its practical delivery, but I'm not asking to bring communism back or anything like that. I'm just saying that are certain things (health and education in this case) which shouldn't be treated as business or for profit. 

[Jazzy Jan]

3 hours ago, rebelvvv said:

No government will tell you the truth though as western democracies such as Italy start to ramp up, it can't be hidden any more and will be obvious.  Also all businesses care about $$$ so they aren't going to close voluntarily (looking at you, Disney World).  Yesterday, the NY mayor was still saying Broadway would be business as usual and today the governor shut it down.  Live Nation and AEG are cancelling all tours for the foreseeable future.

Big tech and finance (aka the stock market) freaked out last week and started all the work from home and crashes because those with a statistics background who understand exponential growth can see there's no stopping this and where it is heading. The only way to help is to slow it down as much as possible so the healthcare system doesn't get so overwhelmed, even people with non-virus but life-threatening conditions like heart attacks, strokes, accidents, can't still be saved.

As an example of what happens when people continue to go "it's just the flu" and not practice social distancing, see Iran, which still insists it has few cases and hasn't tested much but has dug mass graves so large they're now visible from space. (NYT/WP/the Guardian)

Individually, we shouldn't panic and many people will be fine, but preparing IMO isn't panic, it's facing reality.  You might have to try to stay away from people or stay at home if you can for a while.  The time to prep though is before the real panic hits and more of the western world and Australia becomes like Italy.  I don't want to panic anyone or be right, but you can check my  post in 2 weeks.  2 weeks ago Italy had 159 cases, and they've been taking FAR more draconian measures than anyone else and even banned visitors from China early on.

I'm not going to sit here and play the blame game or discuss conspiracy theories, but the fact is that whatever we think, China dumped all its economic resources and medical professionals to tackle 1% of its population in the crisis center to get even its published mortality rate as low as it was (and still 24x as deadly as the common flu).  This isn't something to just think will go away without everyone doing their part to avoid it as much as possible.

@rebelvvv Your posts are always informative and you explain things in clear detail.  Thank you  

[Bretticus]

Our government here in Australia just "recommended against" gatherings of people more than 500+ as of Monday.

Monday... after a weekend which is the main time people go and gather in crowds more than 500+ people and are generally out and about more. 

They really have no clue or no balls to make a firm decision, just making things up as they go along.

[Creepy Insane Person]

11 minutes ago, Bretticus said:

Our government here in Australia just "recommended against" gatherings of people more than 500+ as of Monday.

Monday... after a weekend which is the main time people go and gather in crowds more than 500+ people and are generally out and about more. 

They really have no clue or no balls to make a firm decision, just making things up as they go along.

They should just ban all overseas travel for Australians coming in and out of the country, ban foreigners from entering, and Aus citizens who return prior to ban all required to be self quarantine for 14 days at least. 

 

Wish they would hurry up and release a treatment or vaccine.

[rebelvvv]

 

[Butter9]

1 hour ago, rebelvvv said:

https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/epgkb7/if-your-aging-parents-are-ignoring-coronavirus-risks-youre-not-alone

I mean we've had 3 major cruise ships with issues and people STILL can't get through their heads that they shouldn't go on cruise ships because they are petri dishes for epidemics and pandemics.  Old people/adults literally had to be told this.  It's a whole overprivileged attitude of "I can do whatever I want", "it's no big deal" and "obviously it will just affect everyone but me" mentality that is pervasive.  Instead, people's continued selfish actions cause more and more people to have to become exposed and to rescue them when things go wrong.  Same applies to young people who just decide to take advantage of cheap spring break travel and airfare during this crisis to GO TO EUROPE and bring even more infections back by the day.

We still get cruise ships docking in out ports daily ( Our government needs the coins )  .I have NO IDEA why you would go on a cruise ship after the Diamond Princess , Westerdam and the Grand Princess fiascos .

I also heard that tour companies and adventure companies are slashing their prices to try and lure in future potential confirmed cases .

The madness of supply hoarding from  supermarkets / stores have not happened here in Thailand yet but we are  running out of face masks . Even in hospitals where they are most needed .

The government is very slow in doing anything . There isn't really a proper measures put in place . We are at Phase 2 ( 70 confirmed cases with one death with 34 patients who have fully recovered from the virus ) and will probably enter phase 3 very soon .

 

 

[Creepy Insane Person]

Fuck this decade i wish we were in the 90s still. I’m going to pretend its the year 2000, there are no such thing as viruses and Music is coming out at the end of the year. 

[funkydita]

13 minutes ago, Butter9 said:

The madness of supply hoarding from  supermarkets / stores have not happened here in Thailand yet but we are  running out of face masks . Even in hospitals where they are most needed .

I have one week left of my holiday, I ended up buying a handful of the proper face masks and hand sanitiser on your advice, tbh I’m now likely saving these for my return to London and the daily tube commute where it seems like they’ll be most useful.

[karbatal]

1 hour ago, Bretticus said:

Our government here in Australia just "recommended against" gatherings of people more than 500+ as of Monday.

Monday... after a weekend which is the main time people go and gather in crowds more than 500+ people and are generally out and about more. 

They really have no clue or no balls to make a firm decision, just making things up as they go along.

It all changes very fast. Every day you'll have new restrictive measures.

[whyme?]

Why is everyone hoarding face masks when you can just put a scarf around your face?

[jonski43]

2 minutes ago, whyme? said:

Why is everyone hoarding face masks when you can just put a scarf around your face?

The masks don't work anyway.

But now,

 A public service announcement from Gloria Gaynor