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Madonna for New York Times Mag (Madonna NOT happy)


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i loved the interview too but i skipped over a lot of filler - useless ramble of the journalist - i'm sure she will talk about it indepth if someone asks her about it.

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3 minutes ago, ursula said:

Oh I know the answer to that one! She always uses it when she is caught in a contradiction : "humans are full of paradoxes" 

Well, aren’t they?

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17 minutes ago, pjcowley said:

There are plenty of other people in the entertainment world out there that you can follow, since clearly you and your own head have major issues against Madonna.

I do?  I love Madonna, I'm just pointing out things she said IN THE PAST, I get that she may not feel this way in 2019 but from my own personal experience, women generally don't support and hate on other women.  Men ALWAYS stick together and have their buddies back no matter what, third wave feminists need to look at how they treat fellow women before blaming the "patriarchy"

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20 minutes ago, MadFan said:

Madonna is lashing out at the world, not the New York Times. Otherwise, why would she grant an in-depth editorial to a newspaper she feels is a founding father of the patriarchy?

Exactly.  It's not like a FOX news newspaper, NYT is very liberal

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4 minutes ago, ursula said:

Only to an extent? I wouldn't expect any objectivity from a "founding father of the patriarchy" (btw there is a  timing issue there - no pun intended. I'm not sure how early within our civilization the nyt was established...)

😝 You’re harsh. 1851. One could argue it was the founding father of a certain type of intellectual patriarchy. I always give Madonna the benefit of the doubt. Otherwise you’re just playing to the peanut gallery.

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29 minutes ago, XXL said:

 

Are you for real?

Yes.  It was very well known that she HATED working with all women on ALOTO.  Most women would rather work with predominantly men than women, so many women have told me that and if the woman is younger and prettier , forget it, the hate is on

 

Feminism!  Girl power!

 

LOL

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3 minutes ago, Samo said:

I do?  I love Madonna, I'm just pointing out things she said IN THE PAST, I get that she may not feel this way in 2019 but from my own personal experience, women generally don't support and hate on other women.  Men ALWAYS stick together and have their buddies back no matter what, third wave feminists need to look at how they treat fellow women before blaming the "patriarchy"

One could argue this is a result of said patriarchy. I think that’s M’s entire point, isn’t it? Even if we don’t agree with her, it’s her experience and her decision of how to address that, no? And doesn’t it make more sense to seek to understand her rather than dismiss her, considering this is a Madonna fan forum? I don’t mean that as a dismissal of the validity of your fandom. I’m just playing devil’s advocate.

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Just now, Herfaceremains said:

One could argue this is a result of said patriarchy. I think that’s M’s entire point, isn’t it? Even if we don’t agree with her, it’s her experience and her decision of how to address that, no? And doesn’t it make more sense to seek to understand her rather than dismiss her, considering this is a Madonna fan forum? I don’t mean that as a dismissal of the validity of your fandom. I’m just playing devil’s advocate.

Ok point noted.  I see them from both perspectives, I'm a masculine bisexual guy, in a relationship with a woman for 4 years now, played sports (baseball and hockey) my whole life, was in a frat and have always had predominantly straight guy friends, men always support their bros , most women I know do not, in fact I know so many women that PREFER stereotypical gay guys as friends because they know they'll be a true friend and won't lie to them about how they look or plot against them.  I CONSTANTLY hear women say "other women are bitches and are evil" etc

 

And these are Trump hating "liberal'" young women...

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13 minutes ago, Samo said:

I do?  I love Madonna, I'm just pointing out things she said IN THE PAST, I get that she may not feel this way in 2019 but from my own personal experience, women generally don't support and hate on other women.  Men ALWAYS stick together and have their buddies back no matter what, third wave feminists need to look at how they treat fellow women before blaming the "patriarchy"

And because it is your personal experience, that is a universal FACT! YAY!

Love when certain people deceitfully state a semi-positive only to shit all over it seconds later with a BUT conjunction that leads to what sits above... :rolleyes:

Are you even for real, or do you just troll out of boredom, just for kicks?

 

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I think Madonna is valid in her response as for one, it is her experience and her life. And I completely understand that regardless of what spread the interview is in, why shouldn't she expect that after spending 5 days or whatever with this journalist that she would concentrate on important things and make a positive article. 

It's her faith in humanity again...and good for her. That's why I love her.

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5 minutes ago, Samo said:

I do?  I love Madonna, I'm just pointing out things she said IN THE PAST, I get that she may not feel this way in 2019 but from my own personal experience, women generally don't support and hate on other women.  Men ALWAYS stick together and have their buddies back no matter what, third wave feminists need to look at how they treat fellow women before blaming the "patriarchy"

Why are we always reading that "women don't support other women and hate other women"    That itself is the definition of misogyny.  The way so many lump all women together as jealous, nasty women haters.  Sure there are plenty of horrible nasty women out there who put other women down,  but people are always highlighting them. .  What about all of the women that love Madonna, respect her and are massive fans of hers.  Believe me, there are PLENTY of these women around - and a lot of them are on this forum.  I actually think more women support Madonna than ones that don't.  

Also,  why do women have to support all other women ?   Not talking about Madonna here but have seen that reference used for Margaret Thatcher through to Kim Kardashian.  Why should women feel they have to support women they don't agree with or don't respect ?  If a female politician is horrible and toxic, do we have to support her because she is a woman ?   If a female celebrity is famous for nothing other than having a rich family and making a reality show,  do we have to support her and defend her  ?    In contrast, they will support other women with political ideas they respect or female stars who have talent.  Thus why so many women adore Madonna.  Can't we stop with this whole " woman are not supportive"  stuff by pointing out the ones that are not even worth talking about. 

 

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3 minutes ago, pjcowley said:

And because it is your personal experience, that is a universal FACT! YAY!

Love when certain people deceitfully state a semi-positive only to shit all over it seconds later with a BUT conjunction that leads to what sits above... :rolleyes:

Are you even for real, or do you just troll out of boredom, just for kicks?

 

Madonna has said numerous times that women don't support each other and should look at their own behavior towards one another first....

 

And she's right

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3 minutes ago, Samo said:

Ok point noted.  I see them from both perspectives, I'm a masculine bisexual guy, in a relationship with a woman for 4 years now, played sports (baseball and hockey) my whole life, was in a frat and have always had predominantly straight guy friends, men always support their bros , most women I know do not, in fact I know so many women that PREFER stereotypical gay guys as friends because they know they'll be a true friend and won't lie to them about how they look or plot against them.  I CONSTANTLY hear women say "other women are bitches and are evil" etc

 

And these are Trump hating "liberal'" young women...

Yes. Because the women you refer to have been conditioned to put men at the top of the hierarchy and therefore they need to compete with each other to “win”. This is essentially the very definition of the patriarchy IMHO. Madonna was raised with those values, and she rebelled against them subconsciously, then consciously, and then intentionally. I take my hat of to her on this one. She has enormous courage knowing that most thinking, liberal men have the same perspective you just shared. Again, I do not want that to seem like a personal attack. I just think that maybe because of your life experience that you very kindly and openly shared, you have also been conditioned to see things in a particular way. 

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Guest neeto_mosqueeto
10 hours ago, Monsieur X said:

I'm just fed up of this woke thing

That’s not what woke is. Wake up.

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1 hour ago, justi5myluv said:

The first time I read the article I thought it was an op-ed piece that was written from the perspective of an older women who clearly admires Madonna and grew up with her music like most of us did. So I was shocked to hear her reacting to it in just a negative way. Yes, they could have picked a better title (I thought there were way too many "Madonna at 60" last year around her birthday already).  But was it just me or that M has skirted the aging question too many a times and should just own it? We all are aging and wanted to feel connected to another human being's experience whether you are an icon or not, so I get why the journalist wanted to ask those questions. M should be very proud that after 35+ years she still has solid base of die hard fans who would pay half their salary to see her.  That is what being an icon at 60 is about.  

Good, I will connect with you when I'll get 60. 

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23 minutes ago, Jazzy Jan said:

Also,  why do women have to support all other women ?   Not talking about Madonna here but have seen that reference used for Margaret Thatcher through to Kim Kardashian.  Why should women feel they have to support women they don't agree with or don't respect ?  If a female politician is horrible and toxic, do we have to support her because she is a woman ?   If a female celebrity is famous for nothing other than having a rich family and making a reality show,  do we have to support her and defend her  ?    In contrast, they will support other women with political ideas they respect or female stars who have talent.  Thus why so many women adore Madonna.  Can't we stop with this whole " woman are not supportive"  stuff by pointing out the ones that are not even worth talking about. 

Completely agree with this. :clap:

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29 minutes ago, Jazzy Jan said:

Why are we always reading that "women don't support other women and hate other women"    That itself is the definition of misogyny.  The way so many lump all women together as jealous, nasty women haters.  Sure there are plenty of horrible nasty women out there who put other women down,  but people are always highlighting them. .  What about all of the women that love Madonna, respect her and are massive fans of hers.  Believe me, there are PLENTY of these women around - and a lot of them are on this forum.  I actually think more women support Madonna than ones that don't.  

Also,  why do women have to support all other women ?   Not talking about Madonna here but have seen that reference used for Margaret Thatcher through to Kim Kardashian.  Why should women feel they have to support women they don't agree with or don't respect ?  If a female politician is horrible and toxic, do we have to support her because she is a woman ?   If a female celebrity is famous for nothing other than having a rich family and making a reality show,  do we have to support her and defend her  ?    In contrast, they will support other women with political ideas they respect or female stars who have talent.  Thus why so many women adore Madonna.  Can't we stop with this whole " woman are not supportive"  stuff by pointing out the ones that are not even worth talking about. 

EXACTLY!!!! YES! Thank you!

giphy.gif

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Guest neeto_mosqueeto
10 hours ago, articunocc said:

 

Yeah i mean she should quit it with the rape comments... i just want a madonna era without a pr disaster...

So... you think an artist like Madonna should avoid uttering the word rape because you think that it may cause a pr disaster. What you’ve just said is extremely offensive, truly.

Rape is a horrible thing that no one should have to live through. Madonna is a rape survivor. She is a woman in full. She can say whatever the fuck she wants. She doesn’t need your approval or disapproval for that matter because you want a palatable milquetoast Madonna era.

The shit my fellow fans say sometimes... damn.

 

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35 minutes ago, Jazzy Jan said:

Why are we always reading that "women don't support other women and hate other women"    That itself is the definition of misogyny.  The way so many lump all women together as jealous, nasty women haters.  Sure there are plenty of horrible nasty women out there who put other women down,  but people are always highlighting them. .  What about all of the women that love Madonna, respect her and are massive fans of hers.  Believe me, there are PLENTY of these women around - and a lot of them are on this forum.  I actually think more women support Madonna than ones that don't.  

Also,  why do women have to support all other women ?   Not talking about Madonna here but have seen that reference used for Margaret Thatcher through to Kim Kardashian.  Why should women feel they have to support women they don't agree with or don't respect ?  If a female politician is horrible and toxic, do we have to support her because she is a woman ?   If a female celebrity is famous for nothing other than having a rich family and making a reality show,  do we have to support her and defend her  ?    In contrast, they will support other women with political ideas they respect or female stars who have talent.  Thus why so many women adore Madonna.  Can't we stop with this whole " woman are not supportive"  stuff by pointing out the ones that are not even worth talking about. 

 

I agree with you and I would add that a human being should support another human being who makes good things..no matter if male or female.

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Just now, systemvalues said:

Iagree with you and I would add that a human being should support another human being who makes good things..no matter if male or female.

Agree totally. 

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8 minutes ago, ursula said:

the woke thing is just another doctrine, and a rather vague one at that. any attempt at directing anyone's personal development equals to putting him to sleep. Imho, the woke people are deep in a coma.

Exactly

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