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EUROVISION! The aftermath!


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Guest Amelia aka Neutrocks
Just now, lautert said:

Of course she plays a role in whatever she does, but we are not obligated to praise everything she does as well, and it doesnt make us lesser fans or anything like this, just because we didn't enjoy something she has done. 

No one said she's abandoning anything, we are only giving our opinions, don't overreact over this, we are all Madonna's fans and we all love her.

I agree with the fact we aren't obligated to praise everything. In fact, I chimed in much earlier in this conversation in another thread (that has been closed) addressing the vocal issue, but like I mentioned here in this thread, there is far more to this performance than just her singing.  I feel the choreography was point on.  I don't find her "slowing down", but purposely being "static" in a theatrical way.  I'm not over-reacting either or one could easily say you're doing so yourself.  I'm just offering my opinion as you did.  But at the same time, I'm not assuming it's about "slowing down" or "static" in a way that it's preventing her from doing what she wants to do.  Eye patch or not, I'm sure she would have moved exactly the same.  A lot does play into it, including her age, health, stamina, etc.  Though, I refuse to let them be the excuse.  I feel the performance was choreographed in a particular way and she was point on the whole time.  It wasn't meant to be highly energetic!

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The only point here is she didn't win the GP back. Quite the opposite. The performance (Future) was theatrically remarkable, but lacked stamina and was too subtle for a dumb event watched by (mostly) dumb people. The press and haters are having a field day here. Wish that happened in other event, not one watched by millions across Europe. Yes, attention span last one minute nowadays. Let time pass. Cue to Madonna: if you can't sing Like a Prayer, don't sing it at all.    

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A quick Google search for Madonna produces primarily articles about her controversial decision to showcase the flags.  At the end of the day, if this is what the performance is remembered for, then it’s all worth it.   I think her vocal performance being off will be quickly forgotten with the next internet war between beauty vloggers 

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18 minutes ago, AlanLongoria said:

The flag dancer was detained and interrogated at the airport

 

My gosh I got chills. Madame X is a freedom fighter. Fuck the vocals. She performed a message. I think the message is way more importance compare to the performance itself. It’s a major conflict and people needs to wake up.  

 

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1 hour ago, Jazzy Jan said:

Let's be honest,  the most ageist stuff I am reading is from fans - always bringing up her age and saying we can't expect great performances from her or choreography etc.  Madonna was walking up and down stairs with an eyepatch on and heaving clothing.  It impeded her movement,  that was the issue with the movement. .Pure and simple.   

Madonna is a true professional, a vibrant wonderful performer.  She had a less than perfect performance - obviously had problems with the sound from the get go and then looked nervous but just talking of her age is doing her a huge disservice.    She is too wonderful to just have people bring up her age like she is a frail has been.  This is Madonna, the biggest female star ever and someone who never wants to be pitied or excused.  Love her attitude. 

Within a week, we will all be looking forward to whatever else she has coming up.  She always prevails.  

I completely agree with everything you said Jazzy, couldn't have said it better ❤️ 

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I don''t understand why Madonna keeps Quavo and the likes of Lil Wayne around her, etc. I thought she didn't suffer fools gladly but these idiots can barely string a sentence together, look present, are homophobic, bigoted and Quavo did her massive disservice yesterday - couldn't name a single songs of hers except the one he's already on and delivered Mariah level shade "my mom grew up listening to her". 

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Madonna did great!

For someone who's 60 yo, she was and is totally unstopable.

Loved EVERYTHING! 

She pushed buttons again, and people are feeling awkard. I find it all just amazing.

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It was an average performance by her usual standards, but child, it is depressing to see how much her non-fans delight in her "failure" and, almost just as bad, how little slack her fans give her when she does. There's no excuse for that Kidz Bop version of Like a Prayer but the cries I've seen on social media about her not serving choreo or moving enough and her voice being shaky...Madonna is almost 61 years old, the voice is comprised of muscles and like all of her other muscles is getting weaker because she's aging. Even the finest opera singers say that around 55-60 is when they have to start really transposing keys and training harder vocally. It's like some of us thought the aging process wouldn't actually ever hit Madonna because she's been practically Olympian in her career.

Same story with choreo - I think the MDNA tour was the last tour of its kind (as in, still giving us BAT physicality at 54 which is unprecedented in any performer). There's been a slowdown since and she will continue to slow down.

Going forward I hope she continues to really shine creatively (which should only improve with age) and that the Madame X tour brings it in spades.

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Her voice wavered when she sang a jazzed up version of that controversial song of yore, "Like a Prayer." She donned a black robe and bedazzled eye patch while flanked by monk-types in gas masks and flower crowns doing a sort of Gregorian chant. For her song "Future" off her latest release Madame X, Madge in a feathered Viking costume teamed up with collaborator Quavo, of Migos. The song is actually pretty catchy with reggae beats, and probably has some legs. It was then that the flag-wearing performers appeared.

Madonna may have a different look every time we blink, but she has always stayed true to herself and given fans just what they wanted, whether it was a young demi-virgin writhing onstage in lingerie or a Khaleesi-looking middle-aged hot mama making art for peace.

https://www.wmagazine.com/story/madonna-eurovision-2019-performance-israel-palestine?utm_medium=social&mbid=social_facebook&utm_source=facebook&utm_social-type=owned&utm_brand=wmag&fbclid=IwAR1KxMmyh4dZxrWRBHWjEH1JIurV1rdB3ShjIkrnQoiUPyQdlu3vovJ_TBg

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Meanwhile: Future has propelled into iTunes Top10 in Germany, Sweden and Netherlands.

The Power of ESC.

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1 hour ago, john_andy said:

You might like the performance or not, which is okay, but if you pay attention to what's beneath the criticism, it's rather transparent that it has nothing to do with her singing abilities, but with the fact that some people just can't cope with her still being around. Madonna has not based her entire career on having amazing control over her voice: she's not what you can call a vocalist. She's much more than that. I could understand it if someone like, let's say, Celine Dion had a somewhat poor vocal performance, given that her great voice is basically what she has to offer (with all due respect to her amazing, amazing voice), I could understand the meltdown, the criticism, the fear. But we are talking about Madonna, who is a far superior performer and a totally different animal. Would anybody have said that Bob Dylan's career or David Bowie's career or John Lennon's career were over after a not-so-brilliant vocal delivery? Would anybody have limited their contributions to music to just a nice singing voice? That is blatantly trying to diminish her talents and downplay her impact on music and culture. 

Social media is, in a way, a celebration of simplistic thinking and reductivism (look it up). Do you imagine what would have happened had social media existed at the times of Frida Khalo or Picasso? "Damm, man, that dude can't get a damn nose straight. He can't get no eyes in the right place. My 6 year-old-boy can do better than that". Or... "And she thinks she can paint, she can't even get proportions right, man, no doubt she can't even fix her own eyebrows". What would they have said about Egon Schiele or Man Ray or Oscar Wilde or Virginia Woolf? Guess what? They would have torn them to shreds because they wouldn't have been able to understand them. Nor do they understand Madonna, simple as that. 

In the end, our generation is not ready for a woman like Madonna. Wait thirty or forty years and we'll see what happens then. They will celebrate her then. Meanwhile, they're too busy now complaining about the fact that —oh, surprise—, she's a human being and somehow imperfect. Her voice can fail, what a scandal! 

I think that if a provocateur can get people so polarized and so galvanized just for not being perfect, he or she might be doing something right. I'm certain Madonna is. 

 

I think I love you

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12 on Beaufort Scale. (Mirwais reacting to M's instagram)

also, the Eurovision host Assia war has been very nice on his insta stories being grateful for meeting M and commenting on her instagram saying he misses her

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I love it how this 8min performance inspires people to write lenghty essays to defend her 

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A facebook user here in Greece that is a very well known radio producer and criticizes M a lot posted that he does not understand the hatred she receives everytime she has a poor performance or does someting wrong even from the beginning of her carrer .He ended saying that obviously Madonna does not care and that ione of the things that explains her longetivity

She is such a warrior

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4 minutes ago, dollhouse said:

I love it how this 8min performance inspires people to write lenghty essays to defend her 

It's easy to do it when you think she has defended and inspired us for her whole career. 🙂

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I loved the performance! Her voice was fine on LAP. Visuals were excellent, flags message was great.

every time she performs it is  a treat for me

 

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1 hour ago, Andra said:

Its nowhere near the CATASTROPHICAL event people are making it out to be but yeah. M was always praised for her amazing performances and seeing ppl say it was boring (among other vicious shading thrown at her)is a huge blow to our ego as fans.

It wasn't a catastrophe, but it was disappointing from the weak beginning, went on with the terror interlude and ended with an expressionless Quavo appearance. The performance was a massive downgrade of her beautiful Met gala show. Madonna didn't want to spread fun and party mood, she wanted to preach and kick many asses. Well, that's what she has done and nobody needs to be surprised about the reactions.

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I’m so confused by all the fallacy fallacy if then remarks, sweeping generalizations and disregard for reality , and malevolence most comments seem to portray lately. 

Very odd. 

Maybe most people felt the performance glamorized the situation in Israel?  It’s hard to  interpret thru all the mud. Yikes.

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1 hour ago, john_andy said:

You might like the performance or not, which is okay, but if you pay attention to what's beneath the criticism, it's rather transparent that it has nothing to do with her singing abilities, but with the fact that some people just can't cope with her still being around. Madonna has not based her entire career on having amazing control over her voice: she's not what you can call a vocalist. She's much more than that. I could understand it if someone like, let's say, Celine Dion had a somewhat poor vocal performance, given that her great voice is basically what she has to offer (with all due respect to her amazing, amazing voice), I could understand the meltdown, the criticism, the fear. But we are talking about Madonna, who is a far superior performer and a totally different animal. Would anybody have said that Bob Dylan's career or David Bowie's career or John Lennon's career were over after a not-so-brilliant vocal delivery? Would anybody have limited their contributions to music to just a nice singing voice? That is blatantly trying to diminish her talents and downplay her impact on music and culture. 

Social media is, in a way, a celebration of simplistic thinking and reductivism (look it up). Do you imagine what would have happened had social media existed at the times of Frida Khalo or Picasso? "Damm, man, that dude can't get a damn nose straight. He can't get no eyes in the right place. My 6 year-old-boy can do better than that". Or... "And she thinks she can paint, she can't even get proportions right, man, no doubt she can't even fix her own eyebrows". What would they have said about Egon Schiele or Man Ray or Oscar Wilde or Virginia Woolf? Guess what? They would have torn them to shreds because they wouldn't have been able to understand them. Nor do they understand Madonna, simple as that. 

In the end, our generation is not ready for a woman like Madonna. Wait thirty or forty years and we'll see what happens then. They will celebrate her then. Meanwhile, they're too busy now complaining about the fact that —oh, surprise—, she's a human being and somehow imperfect. Her voice can fail, what a scandal! 

I think that if a provocateur can get people so polarized and so galvanized just for not being perfect, he or she might be doing something right. I'm certain Madonna is. 

 

Thank God for your intelligence and constructive contribution to this discussion! I loved it and it moved me! 

I’m with you 💯! ❤️ 

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hate it how much Madonna is being BULLIED by media outlets all the time

I mean let's face it, this was her first big official performance for her new album (yes I know we had the Billboard awards) and they were just waiting to rip her to shreds

this needs to stop and seriously I believe this was all planned from the beginning, something sinister is going on here

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Just now, Genevieve Vavance said:

hate it how much Madonna is being BULLIED by media outlets all the time

I mean let's face it, this was her first big official performance for her new album (yes I know we had the Billboard awards) and they were just waiting to rip her to shreds

this needs to stop and seriously I believe this was all planned from the beginning, something sinister is going on here

Wouldn’t be surprise if 90% of the article was written in advance 

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1 minute ago, YannBouch said:

Wouldn’t be surprise if 90% of the article was written in advance 

like the backlash in Germany only trying to deflect from their DISASTROUS placement on the Eurovision

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2 minutes ago, Genevieve Vavance said:

like the backlash in Germany only trying to deflect from their DISASTROUS placement on the Eurovision

The backlash in Germany is working. Future has zoomed Germany Top 10.

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I really dont get why so much negativity (specially from the fanbase). I am very sorry, but Madonna is more than a singer. She's always have been an activist, speaking her mind and sharing message of tolerance and peace. That is the reason why Madonna is more than a singer. She's a freedom fighter. Yes, she is. This drama situation is a nonsense! She went to Israel with a clear purpose: to send a message. Just listen to the powerful interlude: it's crystal clear. Much more than a simple musical performance, her presence there was  also a political one (and Eurovision has always been about politics, even if people pretend to ignore it).

Madonna sent a powerful message to everyone who has open to listen. I have received a lot of messages (from non-fan people) praising her to have the balls (sorry for the expression) to do what she did (from the flags, the wake up call, the masks and the interlude). And I can assure you that receiving such messages from, most of all,  people around 20's yo, means everything for someone who has been a fan for the last decade. It means that she accomplished her mission: to inspire, and raise consciousness. And this is/was the  main focus of yesterday's performance. And that's the reason why she is Madonna, even out of tune.

 

Edited by ARCPort1
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I think it's safe to assume that the greater good for M in this performance was to solidify her role as a provocateur and pro peace ambassador, all leading up to even more political messages from Madame x to come. In that she surely succeeded and bravo to her for it. I'm also gonna take the liberty to assume she couldn't hear herself during LAP, she sang that song a zillion times and if you watch the Met rendition, it's flawless. Sure it's not a vocalist voice, so people would have hated that too but it's controled and in tune. So not even nerves would cause being that off when you're that familliar with the song, we'll probably never know because M will not address it, because why should she defend or explain herself.

The only unfortunate thing is that it was this huge televised event, but then again that served the message, and the message is always more important. For those who want to remind themselves what sets Madonna apart from the rest, watch her imprompto concert at place de la republique after the bataclan attack in Paris, that is why she is such a star!

 

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I showed her performance to my friends at brunch and they focused on the graphics, Quavo looking high, and the flags and had mainly positive comments. One mentioned that her voice sounded pitchy but it was more of an afterthought. I live in the US and most Americans don’t seem to care about her performance. But Americans don’t really care about anything that doesn’t involve them haha

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