Eurovision

[robster]

8 minutes ago, domyeyebrows said:

To be fair, as far we know the other 40 participants haven't built a career on calling themselves humanitarians and freedom fighters who always stand up for the under-dog. It is a bit icky to say the least.

On the other hand the statement shows that she is using her platform to address the issue and urge diplomatic measures to ensure peace and stability in the region. Simply boycotting it doesn't make the problems go away either. Sometimes you have to place yourself in the middle of the entire circus to draw attention to the issue at hand! I understand it's a double edged sword from which she is also gaining financially and in a promotional sense, but she has always used her time spent in Israel to address issues and a call for peace and diplomatic action and an end to violence!

[runa]

52 minutes ago, Kim said:

Nah. Good PR would be creating a 'problem' story about her stage being too intricate, the technology being too advanced, her outfit being too skimpy ...all that pish.

Squabbling about contractual issues in public is BAD PR for both parties

Exactly... that "theory" is very ridiculous - I don't see how anyone can win with such a bad publicity. MESS !

[elijah]

5 minutes ago, domyeyebrows said:

To be fair, as far we know the other 40 participants haven't built a career on calling themselves humanitarians and freedom fighters who always stand up for the under-dog. It is a bit icky to say the least.

There is always two sides in a conflict. And what would be the benefit to Palestinians or anyone else if she doesn't perform? Or if Eurovision doesn't take place? Its another absurd of the ultra left (and I m leftist) and I do not see the logic in this boycott. Eurovision has taken place since the 50ties including couple of times in Israel and other European or Eurasian countries with debatable policies. Its not a political show.

[domyeyebrows]

5 minutes ago, robster said:

On the other hand the statement shows that she is using her platform to address the issue and urge diplomatic measures to ensure peace and stability in the region. Simply boycotting it doesn't make the problems go away either. Sometimes you have to place yourself in the middle of the entire circus to draw attention to the issue at hand! I understand it's a double edged sword from which she is also gaining financially and in a promotional sense, but she has always used her time spent in Israel to address issues and a call for peace and diplomatic action and an end to violence!

 

I get that for sure. She is saying she is using her platform to address these issues and of course that's a noble thing, but it has stuck in my throat a little if I'm honest. It's just how I feel about it. I'm conflicted. I don't think boycotting it or calling her an apartheid apologist is helpful in the slightest and nothing is ever that simple. But I can see why she is being targeted for this criticism over the actual contestants on the show.

[domyeyebrows]

4 minutes ago, elijah said:

There is always two sides in a conflict. And what would be the benefit to Palestinians or anyone else if she doesn't perform? Or if Eurovision doesn't take place? Its another absurd of the ultra left (and I m leftist) and I do not see the logic in this boycott. Eurovision has taken place since the 50ties including couple of times in Israel and other European or Eurasian countries with debatable policies. Its not a political show.

It's not a political show if you avoid how the voting works!

[elijah]

1 hour ago, Kim said:

Nah. Good PR would be creating a 'problem' story about her stage being too intricate, the technology being too advanced, her outfit being too skimpy ...all that pish.

Squabbling about contractual issues in public is BAD PR for both parties

I can not believe she would fly 100 people from all over the world to the Middle East without a signed contract to perform. It doesn't seem logical in the least. But of course its a possibility, but it doesn't ring true at all. And logically she would have sign the contract weeks, if not months prior, because she would have had rehearsed with those hundreds of ppl. Someone suggested that both sides postponed confirming so that there is no negative press on her participating in Israel instead of concentrating on the performance itself. Could be it. As for the contractual issues - could be a pretex to run the will she/won't she story.

[elijah]

5 minutes ago, domyeyebrows said:

It's not a political show if you avoid how the voting works!

Well thats why the jurors were introduces.

[Jazzy Jan]

1 hour ago, Kim said:

Nah. Good PR would be creating a 'problem' story about her stage being too intricate, the technology being too advanced, her outfit being too skimpy ...all that pish.

Squabbling about contractual issues in public is BAD PR for both parties

 

27 minutes ago, runa said:

Exactly... that "theory" is very ridiculous - I don't see how anyone can win with such a bad publicity. MESS !

Totally agree Kim and Runa. .  It is not good publicity for either Madonna or Eurovision.  

As said before,  this should be a time for extreme excitement and celebrating a living legend being there to perform.  Not talking about dry contract talk that should have been finalised ages ago.  

[Disintegration]

I wonder how much rehearsal time she’s had for this. She had 3 weeks on the Billboard awards performance for example, and this is the biggest since the Super Bowl and she doesn’t have too much time, if we imagine that she’s been working a lot on the Crave video recently. I’m sure she’ll kill it and it’s all been worked out but she’s not got long to go! 

[Kim]

6 minutes ago, elijah said:

There is always two sides in a conflict. And what would be the benefit to Palestinians or anyone else if she doesn't perform? Or if Eurovision doesn't take place? Its another absurd of the ultra left (and I m leftist) and I do not see the logic in this boycott. Eurovision has taken place since the 50ties including couple of times in Israel and other European or Eurasian countries with debatable policies. Its not a political show.

Yeah but it works both ways. Why is the "self-appointed ambassador to Israel" the propagandist and billionaire Sylvan Adams who's paying Madonna, even anywhere near the supposed apolitical Eurovision? 

Why does any group call for action against human rights abuses? Did you disagree with the calls to boycott  Brunei-owned hotels after the gay death penalty announcement for example?

On a lighter note, of course at its base Eurovision is political. You can hear the groans in the audience every year with the same old countries giving the same old scores to their pals no matter how good or shit the song is. 

Anyway, I'm glad Madonna has made a statement and I hope she DOES take a political stand on stage, as any "freedom fighter" would.

[the-queen]

18 minutes ago, Disintegration said:

I wonder how much rehearsal time she’s had for this. She had 3 weeks on the Billboard awards performance for example, and this is the biggest since the Super Bowl and she doesn’t have too much time, if we imagine that she’s been working a lot on the Crave video recently. I’m sure she’ll kill it and it’s all been worked out but she’s not got long to go! 

Look at her go here. She’s got the moves. She’ll kill it.

 

[domyeyebrows]

21 minutes ago, Kim said:

Yeah but it works both ways. Why is the "self-appointed ambassador to Israel" the propagandist and billionaire Sylvan Adams who's paying Madonna, even anywhere near the supposed apolitical Eurovision? 

Why does any group call for action against human rights abuses? Did you disagree with the calls to boycott  Brunei-owned hotels after the gay death penalty announcement for example?

On a lighter note, of course at its base Eurovision is political. You can hear the groans in the audience every year with the same old countries giving the same old scores to their pals no matter how good or shit the song is. 

Anyway, I'm glad Madonna has made a statement and I hope she DOES take a political stand on stage, as any "freedom fighter" would.

It's SO political when it comes to how they vote. It's painfully obvious.

I was hoping she would pull out but it looks like that is not happening so I'll deal with. I'm glad she has made the statement and it sounds to me like she is planning to take a stand. I just hope it's on point, because to a lot of people this just plays into the idea that she is a cold calculating businesswoman who puts promotion and money-making before all else. I like to think that is not the case.

[FreeMySoul]

54 minutes ago, elijah said:

I can not believe she would fly 100 people from all over the world to the Middle East without a signed contract to perform. It doesn't seem logical in the least. But of course its a possibility, but it doesn't ring true at all. And logically she would have sign the contract weeks, if not months prior, because she would have had rehearsed with those hundreds of ppl. Someone suggested that both sides postponed confirming so that there is no negative press on her participating in Israel instead of concentrating on the performance itself. Could be it. As for the contractual issues - could be a pretex to run the will she/won't she story.

My thoughts exactly. 

[Reindeer]

Sorry to crash the Eurovision thread with this question but where did the Madame X Tour thread go? I can't find it anymore... Can anyone save me from my silliness? 

[Geiger83]

1 hour ago, elijah said:

I can not believe she would fly 100 people from all over the world to the Middle East without a signed contract to perform. It doesn't seem logical in the least. But of course its a possibility, but it doesn't ring true at all. And logically she would have sign the contract weeks, if not months prior, because she would have had rehearsed with those hundreds of ppl. Someone suggested that both sides postponed confirming so that there is no negative press on her participating in Israel instead of concentrating on the performance itself. Could be it. As for the contractual issues - could be a pretex to run the will she/won't she story.

This is exactly what I think

[sotos8]

17 minutes ago, Reindeer said:

Sorry to crash the Eurovision thread with this question but where did the Madame X Tour thread go? I can't find it anymore... Can anyone save me from my silliness? 

http://forums.madonnanation.com/index.php?/forum/48-madame-x-tour/

[runa]

18 minutes ago, Reindeer said:

Sorry to crash the Eurovision thread with this question but where did the Madame X Tour thread go? I can't find it anymore... Can anyone save me from my silliness? 

You need 50 posts, to access that section. Keep posting !

http://forums.madonnanation.com/index.php?/topic/58561-new-member-help/&tab=comments#comment-2776569

 

[fandonna]

andy is in tel aviv now

[elijah]

18 minutes ago, Kim said:

Yeah but it works both ways. Why is the "self-appointed ambassador to Israel" the propagandist and billionaire Sylvan Adams who's paying Madonna, even anywhere near the supposed apolitical Eurovision? 

Why does any group call for action against human rights abuses? Did you disagree with the calls to boycott  Brunei-owned hotels after the gay death penalty announcement for example?

On a lighter note, of course at its base Eurovision is political. You can hear the groans in the audience every year with the same old countries giving the same old scores to their pals no matter how good or shit the song is. 

Anyway, I'm glad Madonna has made a statement and I hope she DOES take a political stand on stage, as any "freedom fighter" would.

Sylvan is paying probably because the money are short with ESC. Its quite expensive event.... I agreed with Brunei boycott, because I thought it could be effective, because it would have hit the king financially. And how would the ESC boycott achieve anything? Especially if Madonna doesn't sing?

I dont dispute that with the voting of the countries politics IS involved simply because its up to the people of the country to vote and they would normally support their neighbours or smth similar to them. Thats why jurors were introduced although I m not sure if the situation is drastically improved.

I m expecting M to give some world peace message in similar fashion she did on Super Bowl.

[Reindeer]

11 minutes ago, runa said:

You need 50 posts, to access that section. Keep posting !

http://forums.madonnanation.com/index.php?/topic/58561-new-member-help/&tab=comments#comment-2776569

 

Thank you @runa and @sotos8! Hugely helpful!

[karbatal]

2 hours ago, domyeyebrows said:

To be fair, as far we know the other 40 participants haven't built a career on calling themselves humanitarians and freedom fighters who always stand up for the under-dog. It is a bit icky to say the least.

Meanwhile Madonna works for years though her foundation to improve the lives of Palestinian women, but of course it's easier to forget it. 

[karbatal]

And I disagree about Eurovision being political. It's a music contest where music is the main reason of existence and where any friction between countries is frowned upon or even ends in penalities (Ukraine caser). 

In Madonna's case,  she works for years to make people together through music and that's what Eurovision is about.. it's a bit painful having to explain this in a Madonna forum. I thought at least fans understood it. 

 

[karbatal]

The Brunei boycott has nothing to do with this case. The Israel boycott comes from the foreign affairs of the county and, quite frankly, USA should be boycotted a hundred times if we start bringing foreign affair politics to music performances

[elijah]

2 minutes ago, karbatal said:

And I disagree about Eurovision being political. It's a music contest where music is the main reason of existence and where any friction between countries is frowned upon or even ends in penalities (Ukraine caser). 

In Madonna's case,  she works for years to make people together through music and that's what Eurovision is about.. it's a bit painful having to explain this in a Madonna forum. I thought at least fans understood it. 

Couldn't have said it better. Some politics are involved (in the voting system), but its apolitical show. I think its even in their regulation. The non politic songs debate was heated when Ukraine won for their tatar song (Tatars live in Cremea peninsula, part of Ukraine, occupied by Russia) - Russia tried to claim its a political song thus against the ESC rules, but it was allowed since it described events from 1945, which was not deemed politics, but history.

[Foolio]

Eurovision is the definition of political.

[karbatal]

6 minutes ago, Foolio said:

Eurovision is the definition of political.

Absurd. Giving points to your neighbors is not being political and there's much myth about it. Why did Israel won if not because public and jury liked the song? 

[Danmacevents]

13 minutes ago, karbatal said:

Absurd. Giving points to your neighbors is not being political and there's much myth about it. Why did Israel won if not because public and jury liked the song? 

Because her song was outrageous and a feminist statement. There are usually clear winners such as Netta or Conchita a few years back. But even if countries don't give any points on certain sings they usually end up ten or twelve points from their neighbors even if they are they only points they get. 

It has gotten less political over the years but as last year's UK entry got ambushed on stage regarding the UK media and brexit. The politics will always be there. 

[Disintegration]

1 hour ago, the-queen said:

Look at her go here. She’s got the moves. She’ll kill it.

 

[FreeMySoul]

1 hour ago, fandonna said:

andy is in tel aviv now

he's there to forge her signature on the contract

[swimtoshore]

6 hours ago, MattyMads said:

It’s on BBC news that she might not be performing due to the contract not being signed it’s made it to British press now 

It is the lead story on Billboard now....

https://www.billboard.com/articles/news/8511378/madonna-eurovision-performance-doubt-reports

If parts of her staging have already arrived and she and an entourage of 135 people are arriving tomorrow, how could they be at this point with no contract signed???

smdh