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XXL

Huge fire rips through London tower block

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I heard it's cause it's hard to identify these bodies and a lot of them don't have dental records. Thry have to be identified to be confirmed dead. 

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2 hours ago, Mmmmm said:

I heard it's cause it's hard to identify these bodies and a lot of them don't have dental records. Thry have to be identified to be confirmed dead. 

Sorry but it's always the same,  even when it's super easy to identify. There's some strange protocol in the UK regarding these situations that only brings pain to families and absolute misinformation. 

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No, it's nothing to do with identifying people, It's a simple death toll. In fact the ONLY person they've named so far is one Syrian asylum seeker. Everyone knows the Italian couple mentioned earlier is dead for example, but not according to authorities. They simply don't want to announce that there are possibly hundreds of dead poor people entombed in the middle of London.

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 ^^ Just shocking and so devastatingly sad that these 42 poor victims cradling eachother in one room :(  

 

 

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45 minutes ago, Kim said:

No, it's nothing to do with identifying people, It's a simple death toll. In fact the ONLY person they've named so far is one Syrian asylum seeker. Everyone knows the Italian couple mentioned earlier is dead for example, but not according to authorities. They simply don't want to announce that there are possibly hundreds of dead poor people entombed in the middle of London.

They should be truthful.  Of course they won't reveal the exact names to the public until they have contacted the victim's families which is always policy.  But they can easily give a death toll.  Who do they think they are fooling ?  Why are they not giving these poor souls the respect and importance that they deserve by giving a death toll ?  I can honestly say I have never seen this happen before with any tragedy.  

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5 minutes ago, Mmmmm said:

 ^^ Just shocking and so devastatingly sad that these 42 poor victims cradling eachother in one room :(  

 

 

So heart breaking.  The fear and panic they would have felt.  

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1 hour ago, Kim said:

 

omg this is devastating. 

And the Portugal news too. It's so sad. So near... 

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The media has really been trying to hide all this and the numbers of deaths

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Such a tragedy. Those poor people trapped in their flats for hours before they died. I just don't understand why they couldn't be saved. 

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Just now, Jazzy Jan said:

They should be truthful.  Of course they won't reveal the exact names to the public until they have contacted the victim's families which is always policy.  But they can easily give a death toll.  Who do they think they are fooling ?  Why are they not giving these poor souls the respect and importance that they deserve by giving a death toll ?  I can honestly say I have never seen this happen before with any tragedy.  

this

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On 17/06/2017 at 9:53 AM, pjcowley said:

@XXL I am really sorry about Marco and Gloria's account... heartbreaking...

 

It's so sad indeed

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On 17/06/2017 at 9:42 PM, Rebel Saviour said:

Such a beautiful and lovely couple. What a tragedy!:no:

 

IKR, still cannot believe this has actually happened, cannot make peace with the notion it did happen

She couldn't find work in Italy then providentially found a well paid job in London but she also met her death together with her bf there. Because people who could afford to spend a bit more guaranteeing security by doing so, just didn't bother, on purpose. Destiny can be so cruel and mysteriously blind. It makes me so sad and angry at the same time

And not just angry with those who could have prevented this fire if their greed wasn't standing in the way, but also upset with a country like Italy, one of the richest in the world, yet one that doesn't distribute opportunities based on merit and forces young people to seek their paths far from home

RIP to those two young sweeties and anyone else who has met their deaths in that building

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13 hours ago, Kim said:

No, it's nothing to do with identifying people, It's a simple death toll. In fact the ONLY person they've named so far is one Syrian asylum seeker. Everyone knows the Italian couple mentioned earlier is dead for example, but not according to authorities. They simply don't want to announce that there are possibly hundreds of dead poor people entombed in the middle of London.

 

 

I have read they were renting those flats for £2,000 a month? And no fire extinguisher or emergency exits?

Now also not revealing the true extent of the tragedy or drip feeding the exact number of casualties takes the biscuit of evil indeed

Such a shame

 

 

 

At Least 500+ People Dead in the Grenfell Tower Tragic fire in London 2017. British media have censored the death of hundreds of people who have lost their lives in the Grenfell Tower fire in west London, a local resident has said. 

Press TV UK Interview:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The cover-up begins:

Grenfell Tower fire DRAMATISES politics of previous week's general election

 

 

 

 

:scared:  :scared: 

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29 minutes ago, XXL said:

 

IKR, still cannot believe this has actually happened, cannot make peace with the notion it did happen

She couldn't find work in Italy but found a well paid job in London and she also met her death together with her bf. Because people who could afford to spend a bit more guaranteeing security with it, just didn't bother, on purpose. Destiny can be so cruel and mysteriously blind. It makes me so sad and angry at the same time

And not just angry with those who could have prevented this fire if their greed wasn't standing in the way, but also with a country like Italy one of the richest in the world, yet one that doesn't distribute opportunities based on merit and forces young people to seek their paths far from home

 

RIP to those two young sweeties and anyone else who has met their deaths in that building

True.  So incredibly sad.

 Everyone should be angry about what has happened here.  Greed and lack of empathy for others are horrible traits for anyone to have and always have dreadful consequences for innocent people.  There is no excuses for those responsible for this. 

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52 minutes ago, XXL said:

 

I have read they were renting those flats for £2,000 a month? And no fire extinguisher or emergency exits?

Now also not revealing the true extent of the tragedy or drip feeding the exact number of casualties takes the biscuit of evil indeed

 

Well, it's a social housing block first and foremost, but due to the 'right to buy' scheme, some of the homes will have been bought then rented out by private landlords. In both cases, the occupants (if they qualify) will get housing benefit and their rent paid for them. That's 2K a month straight from the government into the pockets of private landlords or paid by the government back to the government. Either way, 2K a month will get you shit all in decent parts of London. This block was filled with immigrants, asylum seekers and the poorest residents of Kensington and Chelsea - where a 3 bedroom house costs about 5 million pounds.

The other appalling thing about this is how the relief effort has been left to and led almost ENTIRELY by volunteers on the ground with a complete absence of  local or national govt presence. The whole thing has been handled terribly.

 

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16 hours ago, XXL said:

also upset with a country like Italy, one of the richest in the world, yet one that doesn't distribute opportunities based on merit and forces young people to seek their paths far from home

Couldn't agree more man, couldn't agree more... I know all too well :(((((

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21 hours ago, Jazzy Jan said:

True.  So incredibly sad.

 Everyone should be angry about what has happened here.  Greed and lack of empathy for others are horrible traits for anyone to have and always have dreadful consequences for innocent people.  There is no excuses for those responsible for this. 

 

It makes me so upset

Can't get my head around it

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5 hours ago, pjcowley said:

Couldn't agree more man, couldn't agree more... I know all too well :(((((

 

:sadface: 

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20 hours ago, Kim said:

Well, it's a social housing block first and foremost, but due to the 'right to buy' scheme, some of the homes will have been bought then rented out by private landlords. In both cases, the occupants (if they qualify) will get housing benefit and their rent paid for them. That's 2K a month straight from the government into the pockets of private landlords or paid by the government back to the government. Either way, 2K a month will get you shit all in decent parts of London. This block was filled with immigrants, asylum seekers and the poorest residents of Kensington and Chelsea - where a 3 bedroom house costs about 5 million pounds.

The other appalling thing about this is how the relief effort has been left to and led almost ENTIRELY by volunteers on the ground with a complete absence of  local or national govt presence. The whole thing has been handled terribly.

 

 

 

I see, thanks for the explanation

Is that right to buy scheme by any chance the same one introduced by Thatcher 30 years ago?

I think we were talking about this in another thread last year

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20 hours ago, Kim said:

The other appalling thing about this is how the relief effort has been left to and led almost ENTIRELY by volunteers on the ground with a complete absence of  local or national govt presence. The whole thing has been handled terribly.

 

Truly deplorable

Pure madness. It shouldn't happen in a place like London. But they have no problems welcoming all that money from dubious sources. Mafias of all nationalities and huge "fund managers" assets that end up spiking the prices up for the common man more than anybody else

London has truly become a Las Vegas mess, the irony of all of these issues coinciding with the Brexit issues. Last time I was in London someone told me it's not advisable to confront certain individuals who drive recklessly and without respecting speed limits. Because even the police doesn't dare to do anything anymore, they fear them. Drug dealers with special immunities so to speak, not your local type of drug dealer of course, they respond to huge cartels and financial interests

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On 6/19/2017 at 2:58 AM, XXL said:

 

 

I have read they were renting those flats for £2,000 a month? And no fire extinguisher or emergency exits?

Now also not revealing the true extent of the tragedy or drip feeding the exact number of casualties takes the biscuit of evil indeed

Such a shame

 

 

 

At Least 500+ People Dead in the Grenfell Tower Tragic fire in London 2017. British media have censored the death of hundreds of people who have lost their lives in the Grenfell Tower fire in west London, a local resident has said. 

Press TV UK Interview:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The cover-up begins:

Grenfell Tower fire DRAMATISES politics of previous week's general election

 

 

 

 

:scared:  :scared: 

The amount of people who who are convinced that the Govt and press are covering up the true death toll of the fire, is bizarre. What the fuck do they think has happened? That Theresa May has gotten ALL media outlets, including those who actively campaign against her, all journalists, from across the political spectrum, all police involved, all fire service, all ambulance staff, all council workers, all funeral directors, all civil servants involved, all politicians and reps in the area, no matter which political party they are a member of - all of them, and all of those peoples' partners and close friends - all of them, have been persuaded by Theresa May to "keep it on the down-low for now, yeah mate?" Think of the sheer number of people who would need to be involved in this supposed conspiracy thousands? Tens of thousands? All types of people, from all walks of life - and you believe they're all covering for Theresa, yeah? Nobody in government thinks this is going to blow over. Nobody in government thinks that announcing the death total next week is any better than announcing today. Victims are announced  with caution & respect, not like guessing how many sweets are in a jar. The families of the deceased have a right to know the correct information, throwing out non-specific or rounded numbers to people just because "it looks that way" is an inhuman idea. Can't we just let professionals do their job, and decide if criticism is due, WHEN it's done? Bloody conspiracy theory nutjobs - stop capitalising on death to feed your paranoia.

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3 hours ago, BrendanT1993 said:

The amount of people who who are convinced that the Govt and press are covering up the true death toll of the fire, is bizarre. What the fuck do they think has happened? That Theresa May has gotten ALL media outlets, including those who actively campaign against her, all journalists, from across the political spectrum, all police involved, all fire service, all ambulance staff, all council workers, all funeral directors, all civil servants involved, all politicians and reps in the area, no matter which political party they are a member of - all of them, and all of those peoples' partners and close friends - all of them, have been persuaded by Theresa May to "keep it on the down-low for now, yeah mate?" Think of the sheer number of people who would need to be involved in this supposed conspiracy thousands? Tens of thousands? All types of people, from all walks of life - and you believe they're all covering for Theresa, yeah? Nobody in government thinks this is going to blow over. Nobody in government thinks that announcing the death total next week is any better than announcing today. Victims are announced  with caution & respect, not like guessing how many sweets are in a jar. The families of the deceased have a right to know the correct information, throwing out non-specific or rounded numbers to people just because "it looks that way" is an inhuman idea. Can't we just let professionals do their job, and decide if criticism is due, WHEN it's done? Bloody conspiracy theory nutjobs - stop capitalising on death to feed your paranoia.

 

:blink:

 

10207_original.gif

 

 

It was merely being suggested that the exact death toll is being hidden or at the very least drip fed to the media. And that once again Theresa May's handling of the situtation or the Tories in general is very questionable/inadequate, that is all. And anyway no need to shout as if you had the ultimate truth in your pocket. Whenever anyone wants to dismiss critical thinking and are prone to accept at face value everything that's presented to them they start using the word conspiracy and paranoia to be dismissive. Get real

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^ yes, thank you @BrendanT1993 I don't understand the outrage for a three figured death toll at the moment. What happened is horrible and we know by how the building burned there must be many many dead. 

I'm much more confused about the fact that a kitchen fire couldn't be controlled and extinguished. I read it started on the third floor. When did the firefighters arrive? Where they so late? I just don't get why they couldn't controll it? Third floor is not so far up...

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14 hours ago, BrendanT1993 said:

 

The amount of people who who are convinced that the Govt and press are covering up the true death toll of the fire, is bizarre. What the fuck do they think has happened? That Theresa May has gotten ALL media outlets, including those who actively campaign against her, all journalists, from across the political spectrum, all police involved, all fire service, all ambulance staff, all council workers, all funeral directors, all civil servants involved, all politicians and reps in the area, no matter which political party they are a member of - all of them, and all of those peoples' partners and close friends - all of them, have been persuaded by Theresa May to "keep it on the down-low for now, yeah mate?" Think of the sheer number of people who would need to be involved in this supposed conspiracy thousands? Tens of thousands? All types of people, from all walks of life - and you believe they're all covering for Theresa, yeah? Nobody in government thinks this is going to blow over. Nobody in government thinks that announcing the death total next week is any better than announcing today. Victims are announced  with caution & respect, not like guessing how many sweets are in a jar. The families of the deceased have a right to know the correct information, throwing out non-specific or rounded numbers to people just because "it looks that way" is an inhuman idea. Can't we just let professionals do their job, and decide if criticism is due, WHEN it's done? Bloody conspiracy theory nutjobs - stop capitalising on death to feed your paranoia.

While I don't think posting those stupid youtube conspiracy videos is in any way helpful here, I've noticed that you tend to just jump into a topic without actually reading what has come before (bad forum etiquette) Journalists and media outlets are doing their job in that they're reporting both what's officially being said AND what friends, family, survivors (strangely absent from the news actually) fire experts and people on the scene have to say. The point is what THEY are saying doesn't tally with what the official line is.

I'LL take what people are saying ON THE GROUND more than any stage managed press conference. Those people have every right to be outraged by some spokesperson saying there's 17 deaths at the same time as more than 17 alone had jumped out windows with their bodies stacked up in a tent while said press conference takes place. They have every right to be angry when names are being reported as dead in foreign countries while the British press are saying nothing. They have every right to be outraged that the "council workers"  "civil servants" "politicians" and "reps" you refer to were completely absent from the scene while the whole relief process was organised by volunteers...  while they traipse from one hospital to the next looking for their relatives and friends

Of course there's collusion between emergency services and the government when it comes to this sort of thing. Of course they want to stagger the death toll to prevent the dissent and anger that was brewing a few days ago from boiling over into full on riots.

And it's things like this that make one thankful for the internet and social media, when the REAL stories behind the crap we see on the "news" can be shared so freely.

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