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BREXIT / British Politics thread - cont

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And leaked content shows an appalling lack of knowledge in every single aspect of the EU.... 

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18 hours ago, karbatal said:

And leaked content shows an appalling lack of knowledge in every single aspect of the EU.... 

but isn´t that happening lately with all the politicians? they don´t seem to care how their system works! look at us here for example, in catalunya: nobody seems to know what is going to happen!

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7 hours ago, promise to try said:

but isn´t that happening lately with all the politicians? they don´t seem to care how their system works! look at us here for example, in catalunya: nobody seems to know what is going to happen!

In Catalunya the separatists are using the same strategy as the Brexiters: numbers and thousands of million of euro that will make people richer there once they are out of Spain. But it is an incredible big lie. They have to know it is a lie. But they convince people with those numbers. 

I am sure, though, that many Catalanian politicians have zero idea about the outcome and simply don't care about it. If they cared, they would be having lots of reunions to reach an agreement. 

 

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Just now, karbatal said:

In Catalunya the separatists are using the same strategy as the Brexiters: numbers and thousands of million of euro that will make people richer there once they are out of Spain. But it is an incredible big lie. They have to know it is a lie. But they convince people with those numbers. 

I am sure, though, that many Catalanian politicians have zero idea about the outcome and simply don't care about it. If they cared, they would be having lots of reunions to reach an agreement. 

 

I think it´s more like an Ordago: look what we are capable of doing if you don´t ...

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9 hours ago, promise to try said:

I think it´s more like an Ordago: look what we are capable of doing if you don´t ...

Just like Cameron did.  Now he's retired and rich.  Artur Mas is planning moving to the USA.  Meanwhile the people will be stuck in the situation.  Catalonia would have to pay pensionists from all Spain,  would have to give millions to security and army,  has a big chunk of the national debt.... Nobody talks about it. 

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We must look forward to what we should become, not back, with misty-eyed longing for an expired past. The "British Empire" served a purpose once, but no more. Greater international integration, on a European scale, even a global one, is essential. After all, we need global solutions.

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There's very little to look forward to with this government, and its equally awful pathetic opposition too.

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Just now, CzarnaWisnia said:

450AC27900000578-4949830-Great_expectora

:lmao:   my God, she was woeful. What a disaster of a speech.  Horrible woman. 

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37 minutes ago, spotlight said:

IMG_7689.PNGmetro-may-gif.gif?w=748&h=420&crop=1

 

 

:dead::lmao:

 

Why is the BBC saying that she overcame the bad moment and even garnered more affection and support from her own party? It was the usual tired "building a fairer Britain" without ever going into detail about she's going to achieve that, I guess grammar schools resuscitation was a hint?

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Is it not stating the obvious to say that no deal is not as a bad as a bad deal? These are negotiating positions? I think for now the EU is probably more concerned (or should be) about the Catalan situation, which is toxic and could easily be a catalyst - at least one other part of Spain, two in France (their part of the Basque Country and Corsica) and the North/South split in Italy immediately spring to mind.

 I am beginning to think there might be another UK-wide referendum, it's just a feeling. the only parameter I would set is a minimum turnout of registered voters: two-thirds would seem a sensible figure.

I'm just getting bored with the messiness of the whole thing

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Theresa May has refused to say how she would vote if there was another EU referendum.

The prime minister, who backed Remain in last year's vote, was repeatedly asked if she would now vote for Brexit.

She told LBC radio: "I don't answer hypothetical questions."

The PM, who said during the general election campaign that the UK had a "brighter future" after Brexit, added: "I voted Remain for good reasons at the time but circumstances move on."

Downing Street sources suggested it would be ridiculous to say the prime minister's comments raise doubts about whether she will deliver Brexit, as some such as ex-UKIP leader Nigel Farage have said.

Conservative MP Bernard Jenkin, who was a leading campaigner for Brexit, said: "She is entirely right to avoid being divisive.

"She is seeking to unite the country, not to perpetuate referendum divisions."

Presenter Iain Dale told Mrs May that Health Secretary Jeremy Hunt had switched from Remain to Leave because former Chancellor George Osborne's gloomy economic predictions about the latter had failed to come true.

He asked Mrs May why she could not say she had changed her mind, given that she was leading the country into Brexit.

"Yes and I'm prime minister ensuring I'm going to deliver Brexit for the British people," she replied.

Pressed again, Mrs May said: "I could say I would still vote Remain or I would vote Leave just to give you an answer to that question.

"I am being open and honest with you. What I did last time round was I looked at everything and I came to a judgement and I would do exactly the same this time round.

"But we are not having another referendum and that's absolutely crucial."

Mrs May's second in command, First Secretary of State Damian Green, also refused to say whether he would back Brexit if there was a referendum now.

Mr Green, who was a board member of the campaign to keep Britain in the EU, told Channel 4 News: "I don't resile from anything I said during the election campaign."

But he added that it was a "meaningless" question and "purely hypothetical".

Liberal Democrat deputy leader Jo Swinson said: "It is staggering that even the prime minister isn't convinced by the government's approach to Brexit.

"If Theresa May doesn't have any faith in her own government's policies, why is she still driving this country towards the cliff edge?

"Theresa May says she would weigh up the evidence again, she shouldn't deny that right to the British people.

"The public must have the chance to change their mind if they want to, once the government comes back with a deal."

Former UKIP leader Nigel Farage tweeted: "How can Theresa May negotiate Brexit without believing in it?"

In the same LBC interview, Mrs May said she could not guarantee the status of the estimated 1.2 million UK nationals living in other EU countries if Britain leaves the bloc without a deal.

And she warned that rights held by more than three million EU nationals in the UK could "fall away" in a "no deal" scenario, something the government is actively preparing for if talks in Brussels fail.

"By definition, if there isn't a deal we won't have been able to agree with the EU what happens to UK citizens currently living in countries like Spain and Italy and other members of the EU," said the prime minister.

Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn tweeted: "Unacceptable. The Tories' chaotic handling of Brexit means no deal is a real risk. Theresa May must guarantee EU migrants' rights now."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-41576098

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http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-41585430

The EU's chief negotiator Michel Barnier says there has not been enough progress to move to the next stage of Brexit talks as the UK wants.

He said there was "new momentum" in the process but there was still "deadlock" over how much the UK pays when it leaves, which he called "disturbing".

Brexit Secretary David Davis said he still hoped for the go-ahead for trade talks when EU leaders meet next week.

The pair were speaking after the fifth round of Brexit talks in Brussels.

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Despicable, useless, evil cocks the lot of them: Cameron Pilatus, Maybot, Fromage, Lame grey-Duck hypocrite Corbyn, all a bunch of spineless dickheads, playing with our lives as if they were throwing darts at their lurid local.

I said it from the beginning that those fucking leave supporters were aiming for a no deal, to wash their filthy hands off any responsibility including the lives of millions of Europeans, because the offensive attitude the UK government continues to show is not only affecting continental Europe-born citizens living in the UK, but also UK citizens who have chosen any EU bloc country as their residence.

Current UK government and opposition = spineless generation of repugnant deceitful bastards.

 

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My suspicion is that the Tories want to pursue a hard-as-possible Brexit, blaming it all throughout negotiations on what they'll call the EU's intransigence, before the Maybot (as the self-inflicted sacrificial lamb) finally flushes herself away before the actual withdrawal. The subsequent snap election will see Labour squeak in (the Tories will hope), saddled with this hard Brexit. Then they can have a term blaming Labour for the mess of the fallout of "no deal" (and I can't see Labour doing much to mitigate it; Corbyn has his own agenda). Of course, this might be crediting them with an ability to think ahead which they don't possess. It seems quite obvious to me that if the Tories get their crash-out, they'll want the other lot in to carry the can, and allow the rewriting of history to begin.

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France asks for a United States of Europe once brexit is ended.  

It has been said before and it seems difficult that Germany looses the reins but let's see... 

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The Chancellor has risked opening a major rift with Europe after describing Brussels as "the enemy"
 

 

 

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Mess :semifunny:

Already backtracking

http://www.straitstimes.com/world/europe/britains-philip-hammond-regrets-calling-eu-the-enemy-over-brexit

 

Britain's Philip Hammond regrets calling EU 'the enemy' over Brexit

LONDON (REUTERS) - British finance minister Philip Hammond apologised for describing the European Union as "the enemy" in the Brexit negotiations, an embarrassing stumble for a man who is under fire from within his own party over his approach to the talks.

In an interview with Sky News television on Friday (Oct 13), Hammond tried to quell the anger among some Conservatives who have accused him of taking too soft a line with Brussels. Pro-Brexit newspapers have this week called for him to be sacked.

"I understand that passions are high, I understand that people have very strong views about this, but we are all going to the same place, we all have the same agenda," he said in the interview on the sidelines of International Monetary Fund meetings in Washington.

"The enemy, the opponents, are out there on the other side of the table. Those are the people that we have to negotiate with. We have to negotiate hard to get the very best deal for Britain," Hammond said.

Shortly afterwards, Hammond sought to limit the damage.

"In an interview today I was making the point that we are united at home. I regret I used a poor choice of words," he wrote on Twitter.

"We will work with our friends and partners in the EU on a mutually beneficial Brexit deal."

Hammond infuriated pro-Brexit newspapers this week and was criticised by some Conservatives, including former finance minister Nigel Lawson, for not agreeing to spend money now on preparations for the possibility of Britain leaving the EU without a deal.

Speaking to media in Washington on Friday, Hammond declined to say whether he would vote for Brexit if there were a second referendum. Hammond who campaigned for Britain to remain part of the EU ahead of the June 2016 vote.

Echoing Prime Minister Theresa May's own reticence on the issue, Hammond declined to say how he would vote if another referendum were held now. "We've had the referendum," he told the BBC.

"You know how I voted in it."

Earlier this week, May declined to answer a similar question, stoking concerns among Brexit supporters that she is not fully committed to taking Britain out of the EU.

On Thursday, May's spokeswoman said the prime minister had full confidence in her finance minister.

Hammond was forced into another U-turn earlier this year, when he dropped a plan to increase social security contributions by self-employed workers after uproar among Conservative lawmakers who said it broke a 2015 election promise

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Philip Hammond has suggested it is “theoretically conceivable” flights could be grounded on the day the UK leaves the EU if no Brexit deal is reached.


The chancellor’s warning came as he risked escalating a row with eurosceptic Tories on Wednesday morning when he told the Commons Treasury committee he would not spend money planning for Brexit talks to fail until the last minute.


Hammond told MPs the Brexit talks were leaving a “cloud of uncertainty” over the economy and said the EU had to recognise the “need for speed” in agreeing to an implementation period.


“Some are urging me to spend money simply to send a message to the EU that we mean business. I think the EU knows that we mean business. They know we are planning for a no deal scenario,” he said.

 

http://m.huffpost.com/uk/entry/uk_59dddacde4b01df09b776d48

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It is increasingly clearer that it was always more about an internal party politics matter in the UK than anything to do with the EU itself. This Hammond guy was even an anti Brexit voice from the Conservative side.

Saying one thing one day to placate your own party quarters or the tabloid press and then saying the exact opposite the following day is not exactly the correct and much less a credible way of doing things, not in business nor in politics

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Philip Hammond says a “no deal” Brexit will mean less money for the struggling NHS and for cash-starved social care

 

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/philip-hammond-brexit-no-deal-less-money-nhs-social-care-chancellor-budget-uk-theresa-may-a7994181.html

 

Yet still daring to call the EU the enemy? Ok then. Makes a lot of sense. Not

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