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mtzlplk

What went wrong in the UK?

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mtzlplk    0

After the song, Celebration hit #3 in 2009, she only had 4 songs chart in the Official Charts Top 75... GMAYL 37, Masterpiece 68, GGW, 73, LFL 26... I can't believe Ghosttown and BIM didn't even hit Top 75.... Would it have been a lot different in the UK if she had a record label or company? Live Nation deal is about to end, any hints she'll re-sign with a record company?

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jasray    0

I think it's simply that these young singers are taking over the scene now and the 'older' bands/singers have been pushed aside. A lot of people see madonna as irrelevant, unpopular and a has - been... Complete tosh, I know, but then when these are people who look up to and admire these "princesses" overtaking the scene 

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mnino    0

You answered the question. It was the absence of a real label. Channels of distribution and promotion are vital in any business. She increased her profit margin by cutting costs on distribution... was it worth it? At this point in her career she should have just let the label make more money in order for it to push her music more aggressively. Rihanna was rumored to have a very label-advantageous contract, why wouldn't they put more effort in selling something that will give them a higher profit share? It's a business. Gaga must have a very crappy contract to justify all the money they waste on her. 

She got a bit greedy IMO. She got her money but sort of shortened her chart career by about five years. At this point, it doesn't really matter. She may chart again but it will never be the same as her Warners time in the UK.

C'est la vie.

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dollhouse    0

well, even Steps are heading no.1 in UK still.

Ghost town should've been no.1 in the uk.

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Nick    0

Honestly, it was very surprising how after Celebration her singles stopped charting high in the UK. Just felt very abrupt to me & wish her newer music connected more with the public. 

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karbatal    0

I think that if well hyped and good promoted she can still climb easily again. I mean,  even Kylie gets a top 10 with first singles! Madonna simply needs a UK team.  And if she had a strong European team she would get lots of exposure again in Germany, France... Add a killer first single and she's back on top.  

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elijah    0
3 minutes ago, karbatal said:

I think that if well hyped and good promoted she can still climb easily again. I mean,  even Kylie gets a top 10 with first singles! Madonna simply needs a UK team.  And if she had a strong European team she would get lots of exposure again in Germany, France... Add a killer first single and she's back on top.  

it has been almost 10 years since her last real hit 4 minutes and from her real smash - 12. She really has to bring up another ROL if we are to relive another big hit.

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Jazzy Jan    0

We have discussed this topic a lot over the years and it always shows the inept promotion of Interscope. As a record company, they just distribute the album and don't bother with promotion at all.  The same has happened in Australia and I suspect many countries.  MDNA and Rebel Heart had no promotion at all, not even posters in the record stores. For an artist as famous and loved as Madonna, that in itself is inexcusable.  Something that Madonna's management need to know and rectify with her next release. 

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Jazzy Jan    0
1 minute ago, elijah said:

it has been almost 10 years since her last real hit 4 minutes and from her real smash - 12. She really has to bring up another ROL if we are to relive another big hit.

I don't agree. Rebel Heart should have been massive. Look how they messed up Ghosttown and it's promotion. If she has released Ray of Light 2 years ago, Interscope would have messed that up as well. The quality of her work is there, her inept record company and the soulless Live Nation don't care about artists or how they are treated. They are simply businesses to make money. 

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elijah    0
1 minute ago, jazzyjan said:

I don't agree. Rebel Heart should have been massive. Look how they messed up Ghosttown and it's promotion. If she has released Ray of Light 2 years ago, Interscope would have messed that up as well. The quality of her work is there, her inept record company and the soulless Live Nation don't care about artists or how they are treated. They are simply businesses to make money. 

I love RH, its miles better than any album by a female in the last 10 years, but it wasn't as groundbreaking as ROL and the videos weren't strong enough. I m saying that she really has to deliver an incredible album if she wants to return N1. And of course the promotion should be great.

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Barney    0

 

Yeah, the music channels have stopped here and the music stores have closed down. Nobody knows a song is out unless youre on every tv show going. Ghost town was quite a hit! but it was on the radio all the time. Unless you have iTunes there's no need or anywhere to buy it. It was song of the week on top airplay for a while. LFL I think got to iTunes number 1. She didn't flop. There was no promotion video or airplay for bitch, it didn't really exist. In actual sales numbers she didn't sell much. Radio 1 doesn't play pop music, Galaxy plays dance. Radio 2 listeners listen to the radio. Shit happens.

Gaga, Brit Riri even Bey haven't had a hit here in years. Adeles last single flopped Robbies too. I thought the videos were quite good, interscope should've done more than focus on going on Ellen. Ellen wasn't on our tv channels then let alone the late show. We got the Brits performance and she vanished to do awards shows, radio shows all sorts in the US. The label doesn't know which side their bread is buttered.

Steps? well they have got a tv advert on every half hour, come back tour and on every tv show they can be on. Sad but true. They have been in magazines, interviews even that shit show who's doing the washing up. Like M would do that crap. They have even got a 'get steps to number 1' campaign lol.

 

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jonski43    0

Give It 2 Me actually did very well in the UK. It hung around for ages and still get played but then Miles Away flopped - the video was late, a crappy 12" cover and I think Radio 1 was shifting it's focus towards younger demographics which had a big effect.

The MDNA era saw a definite shift in focus with the perfumes, gyms, lingerie, clothing lines all appearing the same year. It was like a smash and grab to get money. At the start, there was talk of an 18 month project, multiple releases vinyl etc but after GMAYL flopped they lost the plot. The lack of a proper record company to promote meant everything else flopped and why Masterpiece wasn't released properly is utterly baffling.

I have to say, from Celebration onward, the quality of singles has been very hit and miss. Rebel Heart was unfortunate with the leak but yes, another messed up release schedule causing the album to stall. I did see posters in London for it but LFL was avoided by Radio 1 and didn't get picked up by Radio 2.

But U2 have suffered a similar fate with singles. It's just an age thing. 

I do think a return to the straightforward pop songs would help. Songs like BIM and Iconic are too niche for the average listener.

People like Madonna but she has to deliver a product they want  which we know Madonna doesn't always want to deliver which is why we love her!

 

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NoAngel    0

Radio1 stopped playing her music and playlisting new music. Even Celebration spent 2 weeks at #1 Radio Chart thanks to Radio1 support.

 

LFL never made it to top 50, and Masterpiece and Ghosttown peaked in top 30 thanks to Radio2, but Radio2 listeners are not buying singles or Madonna albums.

 

Radio2 played Joan of Arc, Messiah and Rebel Heart couple of times, if they released one of those songs there album would've sold a lot more since Ghosttown actually stabilized it during its run.

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Nonoka    0

Sorry if my post is a little off-topic, but it's the same situation in most of the European countries, actually. In the 00's, up until Celebration, her new singles always used to get a fair amount of radio plays and the majority reached chart positions in the Top 20, or at times the Top 10. Here in Germany even Miles Away, with practically zero promotion on Madonna's part, peaked at #11! Then with MDNA it suddenly all stopped. GMAYL did reach high positions in most of Europe, but completely dropped out of the charts within a few weeks. Since then, I don't think there was any single that got even remotely close to her stuff pre-MDNA in terms of airplay and charts.

In the case of the UK, ageism does seem to be part of the cause since, as others have pointed out already, several radio stations stopped playing her. However, seeing how M is suffering the same fate all over Europe, I hardly think ageism is the sole reason. She was already pushing / hitting 50 during Confessions and Hard Candy, yet continued to be succesful. No, there's definitely more to it and as jazzyjan has said, it all comes down to that LiveNation deal she signed, with Interscope taking over distribution. Ever since she's signed with that new label, her material has gotten the low-end treatment in terms of promotion. We always used to complain about Warner, but they did push her releases hard and made sure her music got 'out' there.  I remember a few years ago how a member on here who was working at a radio station told us about how Warner sent them all these promo goodies as incentives, even for Celebration, and then once Interscope took over there was absolutely nothing. Add the incompetency of her team (e.g. releasing LFL mid-week in the UK and therefore cutting it off from two full days of sales) and it's not that surprising anymore why her singles are struggling. 

Unfortunately, as long as she stays with Interscope under the current distribution deal, I don't think we will see much of an improvement. Quality is not an issue IMO, Ghosttown was the strongest single she has put out in years, yet it too failed to make an impact. I hope once the LiveNation deal expires, she gets back to a traditional recording label who cares to promote her music the way she deserves it.

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Barney    0

Rebel heart (the song) would've been a hit. Guitar based songs were (and in most cases still are) the ingredients for a hit here. The 'singles' if you can call them that were neither guitar based songs or full on Ibiza summer dance tracks. God knows what they were thinking. I don't even want to dare to bring up the WAOM or RH demo dance versions. But ive said it now, they would've been hit and run smashes in Europe, the album version of RH on the UK chart would've been a top 5. Joan of Ark should've been a 4th single for radio 2 straight after the success of GT. They dropped the ball.

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Barney    0

I can see M whizzing round Tescos buying margarine and marsh mellows Hec haha Could you imagine?

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Starman    0

She has no record company, no team behind her to make sure her songs are played.

Same thing happened in brazil where there is no ageism against her

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Rugbyguy    0

Even if she were to return to a traditional record company things are not going to change much if at all. Everyone needs to start accepting before her next era that she is now what you guys like to call a legacy act. I watch era after era now, everyone get their hopes up for a hit, yet fans continue to torture themselves. I'm not trying to tell anyone how they should stan their fav but for me I'm just happy that she's stilling releasing music and touring. The level of her relevancy despite her lack of hit singles is bloody astonishing to me. Put it this way, she's twenty years older than Beyoncé but amazingly still following almost the exact same trajectory in terms of the numbers. Both haven't had a hit in a decade, both sold roughly a million copies of their most recent albums and both can still sell out a tour. After all these years she is still keeping up with her contemporaries. After the Sex backlash in '93 '94 I chose to see every day as a bonus and I still do.  Do you see the glass as half full or is the glass half empty?

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Bretticus    0

No physical formats, iTunes and streaming killed Madonna's UK career.

Was discussing this with someone earlier, and I really feel M would still be getting constant top 10 singles if the "old method" of releasing a single was still a thing - physical releases on CD single, and streaming not included on the main chart. The charts these days favour acts who appeal to kids who don't buy music but watch youtube or stream via spotify.

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blowjob    0

It's not just UK, it's pretty much everywhere. No record label, any new music is just an excuse for a new tour. People are just not interested in her new music (no matter how good it may be), she became a legacy act, and does not really need hits and even any new music anymore. 

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dollhouse    0
10 hours ago, jonski43 said:

Give It 2 Me actually did very well in the UK. It hung around for ages and still get played but then Miles Away flopped - the video was late, a crappy 12" cover and I think Radio 1 was shifting it's focus towards younger demographics which had a big effect.

The MDNA era saw a definite shift in focus with the perfumes, gyms, lingerie, clothing lines all appearing the same year. It was like a smash and grab to get money. At the start, there was talk of an 18 month project, multiple releases vinyl etc but after GMAYL flopped they lost the plot. The lack of a proper record company to promote meant everything else flopped and why Masterpiece wasn't released properly is utterly baffling.

I have to say, from Celebration onward, the quality of singles has been very hit and miss. Rebel Heart was unfortunate with the leak but yes, another messed up release schedule causing the album to stall. I did see posters in London for it but LFL was avoided by Radio 1 and didn't get picked up by Radio 2.

But U2 have suffered a similar fate with singles. It's just an age thing. 

I do think a return to the straightforward pop songs would help. Songs like BIM and Iconic are too niche for the average listener.

People like Madonna but she has to deliver a product they want  which we know Madonna doesn't always want to deliver which is why we love her!

 

LFL and Ghosttown were straightforward pop..

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XXL    0
5 hours ago, Rugbyguy said:

Even if she were to return to a traditional record company things are not going to change much if at all. Everyone needs to start accepting before her next era that she is now what you guys like to call a legacy act. I watch era after era now, everyone get their hopes up for a hit, yet fans continue to torture themselves. I'm not trying to tell anyone how they should stan their fav but for me I'm just happy that she's stilling releasing music and touring. The level of her relevancy despite her lack of hit singles is bloody astonishing to me. Put it this way, she's twenty years older than Beyoncé but amazingly still following almost the exact same trajectory in terms of the numbers. Both haven't had a hit in a decade, both sold roughly a million copies of their most recent albums and both can still sell out a tour. After all these years she is still keeping up with her contemporaries. After the Sex backlash in '93 '94 I chose to see every day as a bonus and I still do.  Do you see the glass as half full or is the glass half empty?

I subscribe to most of the stuff you, Jonski and Nonoka have said. I think partly it has to do with the fact that Madonna deliberately chose a type of contract back in 07 that would have gone on to shift the focus from record sales to touring, merchandising and licensing revenue.

"The paradigm in the music business has changed and I need to go along with that change"

Her own words, some fans do not seem to get that Interscope role is BY CONTRACT not what Warner's role was. Interscope has Always been a sole distributor and never responsible For the marketing of the 3 studio albums contemplated in the 2011 deal

Since you mentioned Beyonce I would like to add that pitting a 58 to against a 35 does not make a great case For observation purposes. Madonna has had a stellar career charting wise throughout her 30s and 40s (largely thanks to her own efforts) which is something the current batch of stars that started in the early 2000s should have in spades and they really don't considering how radio is much more favourable to their age, but as you have said Beyonce is 35 and hasn't had a hit in almost a decade and I'm afraid that says more about some Madonna fans unrealistic and brutal expectations within the current radio system than it does about Beyonce

So technically it was Madonna that chose to privilege the gyms, fragrances, clothes tied to her touring rather than having a record company to actually promote the record connected to the tour. But it's also to be noted that radio and their corporate patterns and now streaming work synergetically within specific parameters that are currently unfavourable to Madonna at the moment.

Totally agree with @Jonski that the general public would connect much more with a classic Madonna melody song rather than BIM (and I loved BIM) but that's probably what they (not the hardcore fans) expect from her.

Still you had a Ghosttown which had Madonna classic pop written all over it but radio didn't touch it, hence ...

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XXL    0
10 hours ago, karbatal said:

I think that if well hyped and good promoted she can still climb easily again. I mean,  even Kylie gets a top 10 with first singles! Madonna simply needs a UK team.  And if she had a strong European team she would get lots of exposure again in Germany, France... Add a killer first single and she's back on top.  

 

I really don't see how Kylie Minogue is pertinent to this discussion :lol:

First of all she's 10 years younger, secondly the UK is one of three or four markets where her releases have even registered to begin with during the past decade, so she's expected to at least fare minimally well in the UK (and the irony is that Madonna still sold more than her there in the past 10 years)

Madonna's MDNA and RH albums went #1 in 40 countries, hardly Kylie's scenario with her last 3 studio albums

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