mtzlplk

What went wrong in the UK?

221 posts in this topic

It's all about the music. People stopped connecting to it. 

I don't know if you guys remember but before the 1st single from MDNA was even released, MDNA was the most pre-ordered album EVER on itunes at the time. Her superbowl was the most watched. and to this day only her and Michael Jackson got a super bowl more watched than the game itself. 

Then the song came out and the hype kind of died...the other singles didn't help either. 

The way Rebel Heart was rush released didn't help this era as well. And Ghosttown WAS the biggest single this era. Airplay was actually interesting in europe. Italy it charted for 19 weeks, it's her biggest selling song in Germany this era as well. And let's not forget how it helped selling the tour in Italy, France, Germany...coincidentally, the countries where this song was doing "good". 

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Just a note: "Ghostown" made it to No. 65 in UK sales (and spent two weeks in the top 75)- that's a more comparable showing to GGW, "Masterpiece," any sales-based ranking.

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3 hours ago, dollhouse said:

it wasn't promoted enough there..

Well, it was the only single that I saw flyposters for. But that still didn't help it and the best that can be said for it was that, by her standards, it was a Youtube 'hit', though obviously, the streams weren't only coming from the UK.

BIM does, though, illustrate an issue with Madonna's recent releases and that's, to be generous, they polarise opinion which, generally, never really used to be the case with her work. Even the people who claimed to 'hate' her would often concede that they 'didn't mind' Hung Up, Music, Like A Prayer, Vogue, Ray Of Light etc. I doubt that many would be saying that about GMAYL.

 

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if she really cared that much about charting on single charts, she would chart.

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27 minutes ago, slam3000 said:

Well, it was the only single that I saw flyposters for. But that still didn't help it and the best that can be said for it was that, by her standards, it was a Youtube 'hit', though obviously, the streams weren't only coming from the UK.

BIM does, though, illustrate an issue with Madonna's recent releases and that's, to be generous, they polarise opinion which, generally, never really used to be the case with her work. Even the people who claimed to 'hate' her would often concede that they 'didn't mind' Hung Up, Music, Like A Prayer, Vogue, Ray Of Light etc. I doubt that many would be saying that about GMAYL.

 

on recent karpool karaoke seem to prefer BIM to old hits..

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She just needs god damn RADIO PLAY!!!! She didn't get any for RH from commercial radios that always play her! Reason for that is she didn't have a proper record company to push her songs to radio!! 

Bitch needs a radio company that fully backs her a hundred percent! 

 

 

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4 hours ago, Kim said:

This subject has been done to death, but you're right in that she chose and/or was advised to take the quick money route of tours and merchandise. It's only at this point that the question is being asked, perhaps by Madonna herself, if that was the most advisable route for her longevity as a recording artist AND a touring artist. 

Madonna also made the point back then that her hope was for her music to reach more people, and in that respect it was a failure. As we know, Live Nation realised that they made a mistake taking on the recording contract side and farmed it out to Interscope who, we can only assume have limited funds and interest to spend on an artist that they are not getting a full return on and who "belongs" to live nation. 

An easy analogy of what's happened in the UK (and elsewhere) is that she went from being the Queen of Warner Bros to...the Kitchen Maid of Interscope and in doing so lost all the promo and long standing privileges being a Queen used to afford her. 

The interesting part is where she goes from here, or when the LN contract fully ends. It can be a whole new start, or just giving in to the law of diminishing (tour) returns. We shall see.

 

 

:thumbsup:

I would love to see Madonna chart too with strongly positioning singles. Every time we as a fan community argue about this particular topic it usually ends up with some fans mislabelling the nature of her deal with LN and her side distribution deal with Universal. In hindsight and judging by MDNA and RH singles placement Madonna will probably want to go back to a traditional recording arrangement as far as marketing and physical release/ radio push goes and pursue a separate deal with LN for the touring front. I just don't get the fans that miss the point that Madonna signed and pursued those contracts, with all the pros and cons and depict her like she was a victim of Interscope

Leakgate and poor organisation in the immediate aftermath aside, I think none of those fans could accuse Madonna of nor having poured her heart in not only quality material who deserved better such as GT but also that she went out of her way un terms of promotion.

What I thought was really disrespectful and in poor taste without any doubts is when Live Nation's Michael Rapino boasted about U2 having kept the recording side to a traditional recording arrangement and how they were much better off as a result of it too :manson:

 

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3 hours ago, karbatal said:

She needs good songs,  good first single and good hype.  It does wonders. 

Ageism begs to differ! She can release the most amazing lead single and it will do nothing for her chart-wise. It's a useless battle. 

Releasing solid albums and putting on great tours is her only way to go forward.

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46 minutes ago, Mmmmm said:

 

Bitch needs a radio company that fully backs her a hundred percent! 

anybody remembers the radio payola for LFL and Ghosttown? It was cute, but didn't help much in the long run.

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I think another reason is, that the chart system changed very much.

I know those times, when I was watching sky news every sunday at 7 pm to know who is the number 1. It was always a big fight. Only sales mattered.

But then when they added also the streams, the charts lost its excitment and maybe credibility.

Also does Top of the Pops still exist ?

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8 minutes ago, jaron said:

 

But then when they added also the streams, the charts lost its excitment and maybe credibility.

Exactly!

Madonna, sadly, is a non-entity in the streaming  world. Just look how many streams the RH album garnered, as well its officially released singles.

I truly think that the media's constant reiteration of her age shaming is what repels the general public from purchasing her music, 

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2 minutes ago, jaron said:

I think another reason is, that the chart system changed very much.

I know those times, when I was watching sky news every sunday at 7 pm to know who is the number 1. It was always a big fight. Only sales mattered.

But then when they added also the streams, the charts lost its excitment and maybe credibility.

Also does Top of the Pops still exist ?

Finished quite a few years ago. Very few opportunities to see music on mainstream tv now. 

Ed Sheeran's top ten domination has really thrown up the issue of songs charting that aren't actually singles. It's a complete mess.

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She promoted RH everywhere, she was on all high profile award shows this time.  She clearly wanted in to do well and chart

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I honestly don't know what would be a better album than RH? The record is everything..for old and new.

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I liked Top of the Pops, because major artist went there to introduce their new single which was released the next day.

That was a good promotion. Of course I dont know how the ratings were, but I quite liked the show, also the one in Germany.

IT was good

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55 minutes ago, Kilt said:

Ageism begs to differ! She can release the most amazing lead single and it will do nothing for her chart-wise. It's a useless battle. 

Releasing solid albums and putting on great tours is her only way to go forward.

Ageism might beg to differ but let me ask you this.

If Madonna released Frozen, Music or Hung Up as leads now would they flop like Living for Love because she's too old?

Some of the reason her music has stopped have the same mainstream impact is because her lead singles are no where near as strong as they used to be.

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5 minutes ago, Confessit said:

Ageism might beg to differ but let me ask you this.

If Madonna released Frozen, Music or Hung Up as leads now would they flop like Living for Love because she's too old?

Some of the reason her music has stopped have the same mainstream impact is because her lead singles are no where near as strong as they used to be.

If they were not promoted or played on the radio, then yes.   I don't get how people can't see that Madonna is NOT promoted anymore.  This topic just goes around in circles, but when MDNA was released,  only her FANS knew about it here in Australia.  I presume that is the same for other countries.   I am dead serious about that.  Similar with Rebel Heart.  So, if Frozen, Like a Virgin, Vogue or Like a prayer was released today,  Interscope would not promote it, Live nation would only care about the touring and Radio stations would ignore them.  Simple as that.  Ageism does exist too, especially for women.  

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7 minutes ago, Confessit said:

 

If Madonna released Frozen, Music or Hung Up as leads now would they flop like Living for Love because she's too old?

Yes, as result of the the general public perception of her age. LFL was a decent lead single choice and could've been a top 10 hit, but it didn't. 

You have to admit that there is this collective pepetuated discontent/ anger that she's still active and creative and expectation that she needs to retire because of her age. I think that plays as well into why the public is snubbing her music.

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8 hours ago, Pedro said:

I agree with @Orion the Avicci demo wouldn't have gone anywhere... 

I agree 100% with what @XXL has said about the role of interscope, Tour centric contract, age, comparison to other lesser pop starts... and everything in between...

:laugh:

Glad I'm not the only one seeing it this way. In any case we could argue over these issues till the cows come home but bringing Kylie into it, like some do, as an example of well thought out promotional patterns takes the biscuit. Not to mention implying, in comparison, she's fared better on UK charts as of late, simply untrue

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1 hour ago, Starman said:

She promoted RH everywhere, she was on all high profile award shows this time.  She clearly wanted in to do well and chart

 

Exactly

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1 hour ago, Kilt said:

Exactly!

Madonna, sadly, is a non-entity in the streaming  world. Just look how many streams the RH album garnered, as well its officially released singles.

I truly think that the media's constant reiteration of her age shaming is what repels the general public from purchasing her music, 

 

Spot on

That coupled with the fact that Madonna chose to adhere to the tour centric model and having a recording home as mere distributor that has no vested interest in making sure she's on radio or that her physical stuff gets properly displayed and promoted in record stores etc

Remember how BBC Radio 1 kept rereleasing that statement about Madonna's music being now irrelevant and her age etc etc, it's like they were more interested in taking a personal dig rather than explaining their choice. How many times could you possibly repeat "Madonna is 56" and not come off as totally transparent?

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Yes people.

Frozen, Vogue and Hung Up would have flopped if released today.

Accept it,it's the truth. 

I don't know why there must be always something wrong quality-wise if a song flops....it's not always that.....if her new songs are not good enough then why things like Work, Shake it off or Shape of You become monster hits? Don't tell me they are better than LFL 'cause I could scream.

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8 hours ago, Kim said:

This subject has been done to death, but you're right in that she chose and/or was advised to take the quick money route of tours and merchandise. It's only at this point that the question is being asked, perhaps by Madonna herself, if that was the most advisable route for her longevity as a recording artist AND a touring artist. 

Madonna also made the point back then that her hope was for her music to reach more people, and in that respect it was a failure. As we know, Live Nation realised that they made a mistake taking on the recording contract side and farmed it out to Interscope who, we can only assume have limited funds and interest to spend on an artist that they are not getting a full return on and who "belongs" to live nation. 

An easy analogy of what's happened in the UK (and elsewhere) is that she went from being the Queen of Warner Bros to...the Kitchen Maid of Interscope and in doing so lost all the promo and long standing privileges being a Queen used to afford her. 

The interesting part is where she goes from here, or when the LN contract fully ends. It can be a whole new start, or just giving in to the law of diminishing (tour) returns. We shall see.

 

Thank you.

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2 hours ago, Confessit said:

Ageism might beg to differ but let me ask you this.

If Madonna released Frozen, Music or Hung Up as leads now would they flop like Living for Love because she's too old?

Some of the reason her music has stopped have the same mainstream impact is because her lead singles are no where near as strong as they used to be.

Yes, absolutely! 

38 minutes ago, Orion said:

Yes people.

Frozen, Vogue and Hung Up would have flopped if released today.

Accept it,it's the truth. 

I don't know why there must be always something wrong quality-wise if a song flops....it's not always that.....if her new songs are not good enough then why things like Work, Shake it off or Shape of You become monster hits? Don't tell me they are better than LFL 'cause I could scream.

Totally! 

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