BREXIT vote aftermath

[Sloane]

There's always gonna be fighting in politics threads anywhere you go. What's perplexing is when they show up in places like Madonna dark hair threads lol

[Guest]

I love PJcowley as well. Contributes a lot to this forum and is a wonderful Madonna fan.

Yes, he is. He's intelligent, has amazing taste in music (more than anyone I've ever known), and is beyond kind. He PM'd me everyday after my mother passed. He doesn't deserve insults thrown at him just because he expressed his compassionate, VALID opinion.

[Guest]

There's always gonna be fighting in politics threads anywhere you go. What's perplexing is when they show up in places like Madonna dark hair threads lol

Agreed. I'll stick to listing my favorite Madonna songs.

[Genevieve Vavance]

yes, plz, leave pjcowley alone, he's super sweet, don't be such cunts

[Jazzy Jan]

If you want to see how smart and lovely PJ is, go to the retro music thread. Amazing knowledge plus knows everything about Madonna and loves her.

[billiejean]

BREAKING: Britain's FTSE 100 index recovers all losses from Brexit https://twitter.com/ReutersBiz

What does that even mean? Why would you be using the third person?

You are European too. Unless you think the UK is in Asia, Africa, Oceania or a part of the American continent

I guess it might be because alot of people are protesting over here saying they want to be European, I've seen people holding signs saying they aren't British but European. Some people think we've voted to leave the continent.

[karbatal]

For the record, I know PJ and I know that he has a lot of interesting things to say. He's also extremely kind and considerate. Karb, you're barking up the wrong tree. Get a grip.

Good. Tell him to calm down, because that was the first time ever I talked to him and the answer was like an ogre with ear ache.

But it's true that I shouldn't have called him moron. Oh well, now I feel bad!

Sorry PJ.

[Jazzy Jan]

Fighting about politics always happens. I still remember my mother telling me that there used to be an unwritten rule in the workplace - never discuss politics or religion.

Of course we should on a forum naturally and in life but that has always stuck in my head. I know people that are married who argue like cats and dogs over politics.

[Guest]

yes, plz, leave pjcowley alone, he's super sweet, don't be such cunts

[karbatal]

Oh at home my father forbid that we talk politics when we brothers gather Sundays. And now we live much more peacefully hahaha

[Guest]

BREAKING: Britain's FTSE 100 index recovers all losses from Brexit https://twitter.com/ReutersBiz

I guess it might be because alot of people are protesting over here saying they want to be European, I've seen people holding signs saying they aren't British but European. Some people think we've voted to leave the continent.

Just keeps getting better.

[billiejean]

We can have heated discussions and correct one another, but we don't have to belittle one another or insult one another. We may be in separate unions (someday) but were all one on a Madonna forum.

[karbatal]

BREAKING: Britain's FTSE 100 index recovers all losses from Brexit [url=https://twitter.com/ReutersBiz]https://twitter.com/ReutersBiz[/ur

Meanwhile...

https://twitter.com/KarolineRerrie/status/747494975479357441

[Love Spent]

We can have heated discussions and correct one another, but we don't have to belittle one another or insult one another. We may be in separate unions (someday) but were all one on a Madonna forum.

Oh Christ MJ again???!! Don't get me started...........

Just kidding...

[Apples388]

Well clearly there'll be another dip in the economy when we do actually trigger Article 50, and probably another one 2 years down the line when we do actually leave the EU, so as most sensible people have already said, it will be a turbulent few years for the British economy. But we will be fine in the end. I'm not saying it's all a storm in a teacup, but the economic side of it will probably be okay in the end.

The ugly racist incidents will also die down in my opinion.

The major issue at the moment (which is actually rather exciting to observe) is the complete and utter lack of credible leaders in Westminster. Brexit in many respects as two fingers up the establishment: not just the EU but also Westminster. The major issue that has emerged is the complete disconnect between the public and the politicians. Just look at what's happening to Corbyn - his supporters are behind him 100% but his own party want him out because he doesn't fit in with them.

It'll be an interesting few years to say the least, but I do have faith that we'll come out of it intact in the end. Not better or richer, but stronger.

[Guest]

I don't think all Labour voting publuc are behind Corbyn. Not even close.

[elijah]

Hope Britain stays in the end. I know the chances are slim but I prefer them in anyways... But if they stay somehow I hope for more integration with them included. I know its wishful thinking... Maybe the Scottish parliament can block the exit? Seems like the constitutional legal experts are not 100 percent sure the Scotts have that right though...

[Apples388]

Of course Scotland can't veto Brexit. That's just ridiculous. I like Nicola Sturgeon very much but that's not on the cards.

Scotland's independence (at some point in the future) is inevitable at this point though, and Brexit has made that more certain.

[Kim]

There was a protest outside westminster with people holding signs saying 'united in diversity'. Then the camera zooms out to a 99% white middle class baying mob of angry SJW's. Watch the video. So funny.

https://www.facebook.com/Channel4News/videos/10153853076771939/

This is an indication of how dangerous your agenda is. Is the white woman holding that small sign that reads 'united in diversity' not allowed her point of view in among that crowd? What point are you making? Is your definition of "diversity" based only upon skin colour? Maybe you should have opened your mind a little while scanning that crowd figuring out the ethnicity, nationality and social class of each person. Dangerously close to one of the bigots complaining about pride marches at the weekend. Is it only okay for people to gather en masse if it suits YOUR agenda? Thank god for people who are willing to get up off there arses, put their ipads down, and put thought into action... while those in their self-contained ivory towers tut and shake their heads.

[elijah]

Shouldn't the Scottish parliament approve triggering Art 50 of the Lisbon treaty? I ve read conflicting reports about it... Hope they should and they veto it. But in reality Brits have to make another referendum to deal with the results and not to be forced to trigger exiting. But there are no legal grounds for it, it seems. Too bad.

[elijah]

This is an indication of how dangerous your agenda is. Is the white woman holding that small sign that reads 'united in diversity' not allowed her point of view in among that crowd? What point are you making? Is your definition of "diversity" based only upon skin colour? Maybe you should have opened your mind a little while scanning that crowd figuring out the ethnicity, nationality and social class of each person. Dangerously close to one of the bigots complaining about pride marches at the weekend. Is it only okay for people to gather en masse if it suits YOUR agenda? Thank god for people who are willing to get up off there arses, put their ipads down, and put thought into action... while those in their self-contained ivory towers tut and shake their heads.

I agree.

[Apples388]

I am rather surprised by some of GU's posts, I must say.

[billiejean]

Oh Christ MJ again???!! Don't get me started...........

Just kidding...

teehee

[Kim]

1) Cameron called the referendum because the media was giving increasing coverage to the leave campaign. More and more prominent Politicians and personalities were supporting leave and Cameron had a point to prove. He wanted to show his conviction and his support for the EU. I think the majority of people expected a remain vote. It's impossible to qualify the validity of votes. Who knows the reason each and every one of the 34.5 million votes were cast? Nobody. So if we're going to question the background knowledge behind a vote then we could equally do the same for remain. It's just trite and a distraction tactic at best to talk about it. We live in a democratic society. People were given the right to vote. The vote happened. A result was derived from it. The end. What else matters?

2) That hasn't happened yet and may not happen at all. The rule of the European Union is flexible (to use a kind word) with many countries. Why shouldn't it be flexible for us? I mean, you haven't even given me an answer as to why it's okay for Lichtenstein and the Vatican city and not us. How about the fact that France and Germany have several times broken the conditions of the Stability and Growth pact? I hope you have a fantastic reason why that's okay. You will not though. There isn't one. Still, I expect you to outline your answer for me. Even if those agreements (relating to trade and freedom to travel) are reinstated it WILL still have an impact on trade most certainly. There is legislation passed that prohibits fishing by British citizens in British waters. That will be gone. Smaller businesses will have more freedom to grow because they won't be expected to follow the same rule that Google and other multi million pound businesses will. I prefer our legislation on animal farming too. European legislation on animal slaughter/farming verges on cruel (in my eyes) and I don't want that happening here. So yes, there are plenty of positives to come from it.

3) Boris has 'gone quiet' because he is in talks with his Political PR group and his supporters in order to proceed with his campaign as best as possible. There are 3 other potential candidates with an extra 2 outsiders. He will most likely receive the position I would imagine. He is going to want to become a recognised Prime Minister because despite being a bit of a clown I think he is quite serious about change. One thing I will say that I like about Boris is that he isn't afraid to get stuck in. He doesn't just go and smile with kids. He goes and plays Rugby with them and knocks them down. He is committed at least.

4) You can't have an informal referendum. I don't even get what you're trying to say. It makes no sense. The talks are informal because that's what happens in the preparatory stage of legislation passing. You discuss your point of view in order to bring around opposition to that viewpoint so that the opposition either passes the legislation or allows it to be passed. Don't you think Politicians have 'informal' talks all of the time? They're colleagues. They're humans. What do you expect? As a Political representative your job is to get the best result for your representation. That's what a leader does. You catch more flies with honey than you do with vinegar.

5) I find that Sturgeon isn't respecting democracy. She is actually encouraging a divide in order to become a prime minister of a country rather than first minister of Scotland. She earns £140k a year btw. She isn't some kind of freedom fighter. She is a Politician just like any other. I find her support for the separation of Scotland the equivalent of flip flopping. Just like she told Scottish people before that they deserved autonomy and needed to break free she is doing it again in the hopes that she will be a grown up Prime Minister. Ironic considering that she is criticising the UK for its decision to leave the EU. The hypocrisy is evident. She doesn't believe in Democracy if she is stating that the Scottish people only want the result of a democratic vote if it suits them. Let me break it down for you.

Britain is made up of England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland.

Scotland democratically voted to remain part of the United Kingdom.

Britain democratically votes to leave EU.

Scotland's majority didn't vote to leave EU.

Therefore she now expects a referendum to leave the United Kingdom so that she can join the European Union.

That's not democracy. That's called being a twelve year old brat. Some other important information:

Scotland has a population of 5,000,000 while England has a population of 53,000,000. Both countries had around a 70% turnout of voters. Here is the result of the Scottish vote.

Remain: 1,661,191

Leave: 1,018,322

So that's a 62% majority. The media will report it as the VAST MAJORITY (as if no Scottish person voted leave) and so will Sturgeon. THAT is why this isn't respectful to democracy. No matter the result it should still be respected. Otherwise we might as well just start living marshall law and do what the fuck we want. Why not? :-/ Any more questions?

P.S Looking forward to your answer on why France, Germany, Lichtenstein and Vatican city are allowed to Cherry pick but we aren't.

OF COURSE you'd be a fan of bumbling Boris. Another Old Etonian who got into conservative politics solely as a career move. With the eye on the prize of Prime Minister like his old school chum Cameron. Of course he's now gone into hiding as he prepares his next career move, who cares about that silly old EU stuff.

I'll leave others to decimate your nonsensical arguments about Europe. I'm sure your great concerns over what waters fishermen can fish in and what rights the global political giant of Lichtenstein enjoy will be addressed.

However, you clearly have about as little grasp of the understanding of Scottish politics as you do on... everything else.

Sturgeon in fact does NOT want another Scottish Indy referendum until she can guarantee a YES vote. She is doing anything BUT telling people "they need to break away" at the moment.

As a skilled politician that the rest could take some tips from, she's being very careful in her wording and actions - while realizing she's restricted by what she can realistically achieve while saddled as part of the upcoming UK negotiations, she's being prolific as she establishes clearly that the concerns of the country about being removed from the EU against their will are being listened to, while ensuring that when someone actually pulls the trigger of section 50, her voice will be loud at that table within that framework, while simultaneously ensuring that her party faithful (who do want Independence sooner rather than later) get some lip service too by saying that option is on the table. For all intents and purposes, she's in a win-win situation.

Her support for independence is not flip-flopping. Do you even know what the SNP is? That is what her party stands for, it's a nationalist party, Independence is their raison d'etre. But they are also the party of government, they are the party of power in Scotland and while that remains the case, the Independence question will ALWAYS have a mandate, just as they also have a responsibility to govern those who don't want an independent Scotland. So it's a tricky tightrope act that they've actually skillfully managed so far.

The Scottish independence referendum was fought on the basis that Scotland remain part of the UK AND EU. The EU question was a fundamental part of that campaign and final result. In last week's referendum, every single local authority area in Scotland voted once again to stay in the EU; an overall and clear majority of 62% to 38%. Scotland is not a region of England, it's a country and it voted democratically to stay. Once again, the political and socio-economic differences between the two become apparent. When and if the next referendum eventually comes, which it will as long as people keep voting a nationalst party into government, I'm confident the result will be different.

Oh yeah, and to claim that Sturgeon, (who's been in nationalist politics for 30 years, back when the Labour party dominated the landscape and the SNP was nothing more than a fringe party and the very idea of them being a force in politics never mind being the party of government was a pipe dream) is only interested in her own political career and changing the word "first" for the word "prime" in her job description ROLLEYES is frankly ridiculous. You also failed to mention that she chooses not to claim her full salary entitlement, but takes 40k less. All of that is sadly indicative of what YOU think "politics" should be about though.

She has certainly shown more statesmanship in the last few days than the rest of them put together as the embarrassing vacuum of leadership at Westminster continues. Oh but that's ok, because Boris has a leadership campaign to prepare for and Cameron has settled nicely into his new role of lame duck and Corbyn sits back as his own party implodes around him ...which leaves xenophobic scum like Farrage as the face of UK...or should I say English politics, as he sticks his tongue out at the EU parliament yesterday while lapping up the boos and jeers. Meanwhile, this afternoon..

.

[Gaudet]

Thank you Webo, Jazzy and Genevieve, that was very kind and sweet of you, much appreciated.

Karbatal apologies accepted, thanks - all cool.

[Jazzy Jan]

Nicola Sturgen is getting extremely positive press here in Australia. She has been described as the only politican to come out of this with any credibility and conviction.

[Gaudet]

OF COURSE you'd be a fan of bumbling Boris. Another Old Etonian who got into conservative politics solely as a career move. With the eye on the prize of Prime Minister like his old school chum Cameron. Of course he's now gone into hiding as he prepares his next career move, who cares about that silly old EU stuff.

I'll leave others to decimate your nonsensical arguments about Europe. I'm sure your great concerns over what waters fishermen can fish in and what rights the global political giant of Lichtenstein enjoy will be addressed.

However, you clearly have about as little grasp on the understanding of Scottish politics as you do on... everything else.

Sturgeon in fact does NOT want another Scottish Indy referendum until she can guarantee a YES vote. She is doing anything BUT telling people "they need to break away" at the moment.

As a skilled politician that the rest could take some tips from, she's being very careful in her wording and actions - while realizing she's restricted by what she can realistically achieve while saddled as part of the upcoming UK negotiations, she's being prolific as she establishes clearly that the concerns of the country about being removed from the EU against their will are being listened to, while ensuring that when someone actually pulls the trigger of section 50, her voice will be loud at that table within that framework, while simultaneously ensuring that her party faithful (who do want Independence sooner rather than later) get some lip service too by saying that option is on the table. For all intents and purposes, she's in a win-win situation.

Her support for independence is not flip-flopping. Do you even know what the SNP is? That is what her party stands for, it's a nationalist party, Independence is their raison d'etre. But they are also the party of government, they are the party of power in Scotland and while that remains the case, the Independence question will ALWAYS have a mandate, just as they also have a responsibility to govern those who don't want an independent Scotland. So it's a tricky tightrope act that they've actually skillfully managed so far.

The Scottish independence referendum was fought on the basis that Scotland remain part of the UK AND EU. The EU question was a fundamental part of that campaign and final result. In last week's referendum, every single local authority area in Scotland voted once again to stay in the EU; an overall and clear majority of 62% to 38%. Scotland is not a region of England, it's a country and it voted democratically to stay. Once again, the political and socio-economic differences between the two become apparent. When and if the next referendum eventually comes, which it will as long as people keep voting a nationalst party into government, I'm confident the result will be different.

Oh yeah, and to claim that Sturgeon, (who's been in nationalist politics for 30 years, back when the Labour party dominated the landscape and the SNP was nothing more than a fringe party and the very idea of them being a force in politics never mind being the party of government was a pipe dream) is only interested in her own political career and changing the word "first" for the word "prime" in her job description ROLLEYES is frankly ridiculous and indicative of what YOU think "politics" should be about.

She has certainly shown more statesmanship in the last few days than the rest of them put together as the embarrassing vacuum of leadership at Westminster continues. Oh but that's ok, because Boris has a leadership campaign to prepare for and Cameron has settled nicely into his new role of lame duck and Corbyn sits back as his own party implodes around him ...which leaves xenophobic scum like Farrage as the face of UK...or should I say English politics, as he sticks his tongue out at the EU parliament yesterday while lapping up the boos and jeers. Meanwhile, this afternoon..

.

Fully agree with you. Thanks for your views, respect.

[Kim]

BREAKING: Britain's FTSE 100 index recovers all losses from Brexit https://twitter.com/ReutersBiz

BREAKING: No-one has even triggered the mechanism by which the country leaves the EU yet. A steady stream of uncertainty is all that's been "recovered".

Shouldn't the Scottish parliament approve triggering Art 50 of the Lisbon treaty? I ve read conflicting reports about it... Hope they should and they veto it. But in reality Brits have to make another referendum to deal with the results and not to be forced to trigger exiting. But there are no legal grounds for it, it seems. Too bad.

Most people agree that it would be unconstitutional to just ignore the referendum result or look for a way out of it, legal or not. It was made clear that the will of the people would be heard etc, Yes, most of those people were duped, but there's nothing that can be done about it now. Scotland's future will also be decided by a referendum at some point, so it would be counterproductive to look for a way to undermine that same political process.

[Gaudet]

Nicola Sturgen is getting extremely positive press here in Australia. She has been described as the only politican to come out of this with any credibility and conviction.

I was going to say how much I have truly admired her, the only one who has show real leadership skills, integrity and last but not least to have ovaries of steel. I like her a lot. Nicola Sturgeon, the only one who took action in the aftermath of the vote, unlike some traitors who washed their hands off the country they led by conveniently resigning.

[Kim]

Fully agree with you. Thanks for your views, respect.

Keep posting!

Nicola Sturgen is getting extremely positive press here in Australia. She has been described as the only politican to come out of this with any credibility and conviction.

Queen Nic knows the score. Even the leader of Scotland's conservatives (an out, butch lesbian no less) got great press for her campaign nationwide. I don't know what's going on down South, but it's a damn embarrassment to UK politics as a whole.