Jump to content
MadonnaNation.com Forums

Morrissey backs Madonna in fight against ageism


Recommended Posts

To be fair when you are in late teens and early twenties, a lot of people tend to think of people only five to ten years older as getting up there. :laugh:

As everyone becomes a bit older your perspective on age changes for most of us.

Millennial generation are interesting because they are much more open to diverse sexualities and races, but people have been complaining some are self centered, extremely entitled, and don't care at all for people just a little older.

M is in a tough spot because of her age and the music she releases, but I have been to several Morrissey concerts, and one show only a few years back. He attracts a pretty young crowd of both straight and gays who are fans of more indie or alternative music. Guess he's an elder statesman of cool while M is not right at this moment.

Link to post
Share on other sites

the new people issue, the most beautiful, is ALL about age. from front to back. i was sort of surprised once I started to take notice. you know, madonna is never chosen as a 50+ beautiful whatever. its astonishing to me cause I think shes the most beautiful person on the planet. just reminded me how fucking ludacris that entire industry is.

Yes, have noticed that for years. I don't think Madonna has ever featured in the most beautiful people's list which is pathetic. However, I feel it must be picked by publicists etc as the same people are in it all the time plus the latest sensations for the year. Always so predictable.

Re Ageism, I don't blame the teenagers, With Madonna, it is more the gutter press that have demonized her for "getting older" Let's face it, they have tried to bring her down for years and have finally found something they can use. The fact it is age - is ironic in a sad way - as it is something everyone faces so her critics have it to look forward to themselves. Other points too. Firstly, Madonna looks incredible - when she sashayed off the stage at Coachella, she looked more sexy and beautiful than so many young people. Secondly, getting older is something that should not be looked down on. What is the alternative - not getting older which means being dead. So silly.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Moz had a huge comeback 10 years ago and gained a whole new generation of teen fans (his natural fanbase).

Madonna gets bigger respect as a classic artist in the NME, they always loved her but the young writers now recognize how historically important she is. Although they now seem to prefer Jacko (perhaps cuz the writers were weaned on him?). They still review M's albums but the RH review was obscenely ageist and NME, despite constantly referencing classic rock (let these little fuckers discover shit themselves!) no longer have writers over 30 - but perhaps it's only natural and fair the youth should cover youth issues?

Link to post
Share on other sites

To be fair when you are in late teens and early twenties, a lot of people tend to think of people only five to ten years older as getting up there. :laugh:

As everyone becomes a bit older your perspective on age changes for most of us.

Millennial generation are interesting because they are much more open to diverse sexualities and races, but people have been complaining some are self centered, extremely entitled, and don't care at all for people just a little older.

M is in a tough spot because of her age and the music she releases, but I have been to several Morrissey concerts, and one show only a few years back. He attracts a pretty young crowd of both straight and gays who are fans of more indie or alternative music. Guess he's an elder statesman of cool while M is not right at this moment.

Yes, because he's a man. Men are viewed much differently when it comes to age. They are seen as sophisticated, refined.

Women, unfortunately, aren't viewed this way. And I hate to say that M will, sadly, continue to be especially shit on and singled out because of who she is. It sucks.

Link to post
Share on other sites

The industry is so focused on youth that they come up with the most stupid things thinking 'youngsters" will like it. Look at wikileaks, they unearthed a project that was rejected about an EDM Spiderman movie. Most teens today listen to the same things they were listening to when i was a teen and even when my isters were teens : Bob Marley, Pink Floyd, Nirvana....

Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes, because he's a man. Men are viewed much differently when it comes to age. They are seen as sophisticated, refined.

Women, unfortunately, aren't viewed this way. And I hate to say that M will, sadly, continue to be especially shit on and singled out because of who she is. It sucks.

True...I've been reading some comments regarding this ageism and sexism issues and it was quite depressing to see what people had to say, unfortunately this is how the society thinks I guess. Basically fertility declines as a woman ages and once she loses it, which happens sometime in her 40's, she's no longer useful, she's good for nothing and can no longer be seen as a sexual object because she cannot reproduce anymore. Therefore she should stop behaving certain ways, like acting and looking sexy because that's only used to attract males, so once she's no longer capable of reproduction what's the point in being sexual? it's "gross" now and it's just trying to "trick" males.

Youthfulness is everything to a woman, while for men that's never an issue as the fertility decline takes place way later in life.

This sort of mentality is not going to change, Madonna will probably face ageism shit forever.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, now you get fired at work when you reach 40 if you are earning too much, at least in countries like Spain where the UE is always asking for a flexible job market and firms are trying to reduce costs to incentivate exports. That means that people in their 20s earn half as much, and are hired. Nowadays, if you lose your job in Spain, you can kiss your live goodbye.

So ageism is one big problem in capitalism and sooner or later affect us all. In my case, there are strong rumors of firing people at my newspaper and i can be the target. I'm not scared, though. I will stand up as Madonna did in the Brits and start a new life no matter how hard it is.

FUCK AGEISM! Just when you are experienced and know your way, they don't want you anymore .Ugh.

Link to post
Share on other sites

True...I've been reading some comments regarding this ageism and sexism issues and it was quite depressing to see what people had to say, unfortunately this is how the society thinks I guess. Basically fertility declines as a woman ages and once she loses it, which happens sometime in her 40's, she's no longer useful, she's good for nothing and can no longer be seen as a sexual object because she cannot reproduce anymore. Therefore she should stop behaving certain ways, like acting and looking sexy because that's only used to attract males, so once she's no longer capable of reproduction what's the point in being sexual? it's "gross" now and it's just trying to "trick" males.

Youthfulness is everything to a woman, while for men that's never an issue as the fertility decline takes place way later in life.

This sort of mentality is not going to change, Madonna will probably face ageism shit forever.

You are right, it is very depressing that this is the view in this culture. Women are often seen as these disposable creatures or objects, with little to no value. Ageism is just another sad example of this.

I so admire Madonna for fighting this good fight, refusing to back down, and refusing to submit to the standards that are continually placed on her. This is been her entire career, as we all know, and her age is just another characteristic that people want to attack and make her feel bad about. Her presence in this world is such a light, and I wish more people would understand that. We owe so much to her!

Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, now you get fired at work when you reach 40 if you are earning too much, at least in countries like Spain where the UE is always asking for a flexible job market and firms are trying to reduce costs to incentivate exports. That means that people in their 20s earn half as much, and are hired. Nowadays, if you lose your job in Spain, you can kiss your live goodbye.

So ageism is one big problem in capitalism and sooner or later affect us all. In my case, there are strong rumors of firing people at my newspaper and i can be the target. I'm not scared, though. I will stand up as Madonna did in the Brits and start a new life no matter how hard it is.

FUCK AGEISM! Just when you are experienced and know your way, they don't want you anymore .Ugh.

I hear you. God forbid you lose your job in your 40s/50s/60s+ because the chances of getting re-hired at the same salary you previously had is very slim. Employers, like you said, want younger people who they can pay a lot less.

Link to post
Share on other sites

That's why, all of those who now gloat and call Madonna names will have karma smashing their silly faces pretty soon.

Truth.

I remember not being able to imagine life beyond 20, and here I am, 37 years old! 40 will be here before I know it. lol :)

Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Rachelle of London

Thanks Karby for acknowledging ageism in the "real world" in the corporate world it's disgusting. Companies looking for every excuse to get rid of older staff.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks Karby for acknowledging ageism in the "real world" in the corporate world it's disgusting. Companies looking for every excuse to get rid of older staff.

That's where ageism is an issue and taken more seriously.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Tori Amos joins the anti ageism team:

The Guardian: There seems to be a vilification of older women – Madonna took a lot of flak when she fell at the Brits.

Tori Amos: Let me ask you: was there a lot of meanness about her?

The Guardian: There were a lot of unpleasant comments on Twitter.

Tori Amos: Madonna is an entertainer. There are very few people who could’ve gotten up off that floor. It wasn’t because of her that she fell, but it was because of her that the performance carried on. Some of the vilification comes from women as much as men. She’s making choices and she’s able to do things physically that a lot of people 25 years younger can’t; she got up and refused to allow that to shame her. I think people want her to be shamed into a role that they find acceptable for her age. It makes me sad that we can’t embrace Madonna and say, Wow, this is an artist who’s expressing herself in a certain way.

Read more: http://www.madonnarama.com/posts-en/2015/04/24/tori-amos-it-makes-me-sad-that-we-cant-embrace-madonna/#ixzz3YFz7Mr1n

Link to post
Share on other sites

Women I know we're laughing about her fall, saying she deserved it and she needs to stop her performances as she is too old. I can't say I was particularly a fan of the overblown cloak entrance at The Brits or some of the more lewd HC promo era but...

Er, hello, this is MADONNA. She is not going to stop and tone it down to fit in. She wouldn't be the force she is if that is how she approached her career. She can do what the fuck she wants and i would rather her do that and make some mistakes than fade into a shadow of her former self.

And a risk taker can only deliver epic performances like BIM on Fallon.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Interesting article on ageism in Pitchfork. (it might be good to combine the threads related to this issue into one since there is overlap of points and discussion)

http://pitchfork.com/thepitch/750-ageism-lou-reeds-lulu-madonnas-tongue-and-jazz-fest/

Ageism, Lou Reed's Lulu, Madonna's Tongue and Jazz Fest

By Paul de Revere, April 24, 2015 at 11:45 a.m. EDT

Lou Reed and Metallica’s ill-fated collaboration Lulu is a record we’d all like to forget exists. Critics panned it like crazy when it came out, smacking it around like negative-review batting practice. As Pitchfork contributor Jeremy Larson pointed out in a piece for Consequence of Sound, some of the hottest of these hot takes likened 2011’s Lulu to "your dad’s drunk friend reciting his self-penned erotica over a melting Reload cassette" and "bleating like a dementia-stricken uncle." In a rare 1.0 rating, this website used the word "crotchety" to describe Reed’s lyrics.

The choice of loaded words make it clear: ageism comes out when we're confronting (weird) work our heroes are making "past their prime", when we struggle to make space for their work in the now.

The art-rock legend, who died of liver disease at 71, isn’t here to defend himself but, in a way, he got the last laugh: when Reed was inducted into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame last week, celebrated performance artist (and Reed’s widow) Laurie Anderson
cited David Bowie’s praise for the maligned LP. "This is Lou’s greatest work; this is his masterpiece," Anderson quoted Bowie. "Just wait, it will be like Berlin. It will take everyone a while to catch up." It’s unlikely that this will kick off a reconsideration of Lulu, but is a potent reminder of how omnipresent ageism is at every turn.

Ageism was certainly present in the way-too-freaked reactions to Madonna’s Kiss Heard ’Round the Web post-Coachella. Madonna—her artistry, like Reed’s, bred at similar New York art-and-club-world depths—seems to derive joy from causing audiences shock. If true, she must’ve been over the moon about how the highly performative kiss she planted on Drake played out.

"They're judging me by my age," she told Rolling Stone in February. "I don't understand. I'm trying to get my head around it. Because women, generally, when they reach a certain age, have accepted that they're not allowed to behave a certain way. But I don't follow the rules. I never did, and I'm not going to start."

Madonna wasn’t the only performer aging defiantly at Coachella. AC/DC headlined with their first live date in six years. Steely Dan’s Coachella exploits have been captured by Donald Fagen’s hilarious Coachella tour diaries in Rolling Stone, in which he clearly doesn’t seem to give a shit about whether the Kids at Coachella know his music or not. Fagen’s diary entries make him seem cooler than most Coachella attendees a third his age—it’s certainly a better look than WEARING A HEADDRESS or disparaging Madonna’s looks.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Interesting article on ageism in Pitchfork. (it might be good to combine the threads related to this issue into one since there is overlap of points and discussion)

http://pitchfork.com/thepitch/750-ageism-lou-reeds-lulu-madonnas-tongue-and-jazz-fest/

Ageism, Lou Reed's Lulu, Madonna's Tongue and Jazz Fest

By Paul de Revere, April 24, 2015 at 11:45 a.m. EDT

Lou Reed and Metallica’s ill-fated collaboration Lulu is a record we’d all like to forget exists. Critics panned it like crazy when it came out, smacking it around like negative-review batting practice. As Pitchfork contributor Jeremy Larson pointed out in a piece for Consequence of Sound, some of the hottest of these hot takes likened 2011’s Lulu to "your dad’s drunk friend reciting his self-penned erotica over a melting Reload cassette" and "bleating like a dementia-stricken uncle." In a rare 1.0 rating, this website used the word "crotchety" to describe Reed’s lyrics.

The choice of loaded words make it clear: ageism comes out when we're confronting (weird) work our heroes are making "past their prime", when we struggle to make space for their work in the now.

The art-rock legend, who died of liver disease at 71, isn’t here to defend himself but, in a way, he got the last laugh: when Reed was inducted into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame last week, celebrated performance artist (and Reed’s widow) Laurie Anderson cited David Bowie’s praise for the maligned LP. "This is Lou’s greatest work; this is his masterpiece," Anderson quoted Bowie. "Just wait, it will be like Berlin. It will take everyone a while to catch up." It’s unlikely that this will kick off a reconsideration of Lulu, but is a potent reminder of how omnipresent ageism is at every turn.

Ageism was certainly present in the way-too-freaked reactions to Madonna’s Kiss Heard ’Round the Web post-Coachella. Madonna—her artistry, like Reed’s, bred at similar New York art-and-club-world depths—seems to derive joy from causing audiences shock. If true, she must’ve been over the moon about how the highly performative kiss she planted on Drake played out.

"They're judging me by my age," she told Rolling Stone in February. "I don't understand. I'm trying to get my head around it. Because women, generally, when they reach a certain age, have accepted that they're not allowed to behave a certain way. But I don't follow the rules. I never did, and I'm not going to start."

Madonna wasn’t the only performer aging defiantly at Coachella. AC/DC headlined with their first live date in six years. Steely Dan’s Coachella exploits have been captured by Donald Fagen’s hilarious Coachella tour diaries in Rolling Stone, in which he clearly doesn’t seem to give a shit about whether the Kids at Coachella know his music or not. Fagen’s diary entries make him seem cooler than most Coachella attendees a third his age—it’s certainly a better look than WEARING A HEADDRESS or disparaging Madonna’s looks.

:clap:

Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest HaveASit

Interesting article on ageism in Pitchfork. (it might be good to combine the threads related to this issue into one since there is overlap of points and discussion)

http://pitchfork.com/thepitch/750-ageism-lou-reeds-lulu-madonnas-tongue-and-jazz-fest/

Ageism, Lou Reed's Lulu, Madonna's Tongue and Jazz Fest

By Paul de Revere, April 24, 2015 at 11:45 a.m. EDT

Lou Reed and Metallica’s ill-fated collaboration Lulu is a record we’d all like to forget exists. Critics panned it like crazy when it came out, smacking it around like negative-review batting practice. As Pitchfork contributor Jeremy Larson pointed out in a piece for Consequence of Sound, some of the hottest of these hot takes likened 2011’s Lulu to "your dad’s drunk friend reciting his self-penned erotica over a melting Reload cassette" and "bleating like a dementia-stricken uncle." In a rare 1.0 rating, this website used the word "crotchety" to describe Reed’s lyrics.

The choice of loaded words make it clear: ageism comes out when we're confronting (weird) work our heroes are making "past their prime", when we struggle to make space for their work in the now.

The art-rock legend, who died of liver disease at 71, isn’t here to defend himself but, in a way, he got the last laugh: when Reed was inducted into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame last week, celebrated performance artist (and Reed’s widow) Laurie Anderson cited David Bowie’s praise for the maligned LP. "This is Lou’s greatest work; this is his masterpiece," Anderson quoted Bowie. "Just wait, it will be like Berlin. It will take everyone a while to catch up." It’s unlikely that this will kick off a reconsideration of Lulu, but is a potent reminder of how omnipresent ageism is at every turn.

Ageism was certainly present in the way-too-freaked reactions to Madonna’s Kiss Heard ’Round the Web post-Coachella. Madonna—her artistry, like Reed’s, bred at similar New York art-and-club-world depths—seems to derive joy from causing audiences shock. If true, she must’ve been over the moon about how the highly performative kiss she planted on Drake played out.

"They're judging me by my age," she told Rolling Stone in February. "I don't understand. I'm trying to get my head around it. Because women, generally, when they reach a certain age, have accepted that they're not allowed to behave a certain way. But I don't follow the rules. I never did, and I'm not going to start."

Madonna wasn’t the only performer aging defiantly at Coachella. AC/DC headlined with their first live date in six years. Steely Dan’s Coachella exploits have been captured by Donald Fagen’s hilarious Coachella tour diaries in Rolling Stone, in which he clearly doesn’t seem to give a shit about whether the Kids at Coachella know his music or not. Fagen’s diary entries make him seem cooler than most Coachella attendees a third his age—it’s certainly a better look than WEARING A HEADDRESS or disparaging Madonna’s looks.

Oh please. Pitchfork is so full of shit. They are the first ones to trash new albums by older artists like Madonna and Prince, yet they praise flavour-of-the-month shits like Ariana Grande

Link to post
Share on other sites
×
×
  • Create New...