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The moment that never was: Madonna on MJ's "In The Closet"


TearsInHeaven

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I think "totally different" is a bit of a stretch. He may have changed things up, but IMO, his albums were always paint by numbers.

Songs about saving the world.

Songs about children.

Songs about being a badass.

Songs about the media.

Some love songs to pad it a bit.

Call it an album.

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Exactly.

Ricky Martin

Britney Spears

Justin Timberlake

Nikki Minaj

Miley Cyrus

ALL well beneath her. The only person she's duetted with on her level I can think of is Prince.

But what about Pharrell :wow:

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Guest bluejean

But what about Pharrell :wow:

She didn't duet with Pharrell, he produced. And he's utterly amazing and in a different league to the aforementioned.

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In the end Michael DID get Madonna's ideas for the In the closet video. He did not cut his hait but had it pulled back tight in a ponytail and removed all the buckles and ugly stuff he used to wear for a simple slick new look and it 's his only video where he looks good.

Advocate: …I keep telling Michael Jackson, “I’d love to turn Jose and Luis [Madonna's dancers] on you for a week.” They pull you out of the shoe box you’re in. Anybody who’s in a shoe box in the closet cannot be in one after hanging around with Luis and Jose. Or me, for that matter.

Madonna: I have this whole vision about Michael. We’re considering working on a song together. I would like to completely redo his whole image, give him a Caesar — you know, that really short haircut — and I want to get him out of those buckly boots and all that stuff. What I want him to do is go to New York and hang out for a week with the House of Extravaganza [ a group of voguers]. They could give him a new style. I’ve already asked Jose and Luis if they would do it. They’re thrilled and ready. I said, “Could you give this guy a make-over for me?” because I think that’s really what he needs.

Advocate: Is he up for it?
Madonna: I don’t know. He’s up for a couple of things that surprise me. The thing is, I’m not going to get together and do some stupid ballad or love duet — no one’s going to buy it, first of all. I said, “Look, Michael, if you want to do something with me, you have to be willing to go all the way or I’m not going to do it.” He keeps saying yes.

Xtravaganza’s RX for Michael, Apr 21, 1991

You can’t get the kind of makeover Madonna has in mind for Michael Jackson from Adrien Arpel. So she’s sending her soon-to-be singing partner for a complete overhaul at the House of Xtravaganza, says the family of downtown drag queens who took voguing mainstream.

“What I want him to do is go to New York and hang out for a week with the House of Xtravaganza,” she said in her interview in The Advocate, a gay biweekly magazine. Two of the house members, Luis Camacho and Jose Gutierez, danced with Madonna on the Blond Ambition tour that was the basis for the soon-to-be-released documentary, “Truth or Dare.”

They could give him a new style because I think that’s really what he needs, she said in the magazine interview. So with a tentative makeover date set for the first week of May, the boys are ready and waiting, they said, in an interview last week, in the mirrored living room of the family’s oneman Senate Ganza lawmaker deejay and record producer David Depino.

The first order of business: a short army style Caesar haircut to show the face he’s obviously proud of, Depino said, next; the glove and the sunglasses the buckles and the boots and apres an hamburger for the vegetarian to put a little meat on Michael’s undernourished bones.

While they plotted the upcoming makeover, Camacho got a phone message that Madonna had called looking for him twice. Let’s call back and tell her we’re dishing her he said dialing her number in Los Angeles. On the road they said the June Cleaver of the boys from the House of Xtravaganza had spoiled them rotten. She was the mother and we were the bratty little kids. We played Christina to her Mommy Dearest and called Warren Beatty ”Uncle Warren”, Camacho said.

But whenever anything went wrong we were like Madonna. Before each concert they said the performers joined hands and formed a prayer circle. Only Madonna was allowed to talk to the Big Guy which was OK with them.

We’re her accessories, her earrings and her bracelets Camacho explained. She talked in the prayer circle, he said, because she had a lot of things a lot of stress to get off her chest like the coffee was’nt hot enough or the salad wasnt crisp enough.

They miss her they said and when she asked them to make over Jackson they eagerly agreed. She loves the way I dress and wants Jackson to learn from my example said Gutierez 20 perhaps best known for his role as the devil in his mentor’s controversial Justify My Love video. For the interview, Gutierez was casually clad in jeans and a leather vest accessorized by a collection of silver rings and earrings. But for evening wear I’m into what’s out he said. I mean who wears underwear with leather chaps? I’m a fashion victim. Camacho, 21, said he favors velour tights and scandalous shirts but dresses differently each day depending on his mood. One day I might go homeboyish but with really big earrings just to throw off the ensemble. Another day it might be a leather skirt and a bustier he said wondering aloud if Jackson would wear a skirt. He would’nt have the legs for it Gutierez sniffed.

But all the Ganzas emphasized that the makeover will proceed from the inside out. Clothes definitely but it’s more of an attitude change giving him more confidence and more street savvy said Camacho. Not that we’re psychologists but he needs just a talk, a hang, a drink at a lonely bar down in Soho, a trip to the rooftop to let him scream. So the next time he receives an award he can say more than Thank you, said Depino .

Xtravaganza life they said is just that extravagant in every way. At the downtown clubs they frequent Camacho said we strut the club heads held high plumage out and feathers being ruffled Honorary Lauren Hutton Tookie Smith and Ali mcgraw.

I told her Love is never having to say you cant be an Xtravaganza said Depino.I said Throw away that stocking hat and you can be a Ganza.

While members of other downtown houses feel the highpro glow and come for us we vogue them out on the dance floor until they feel this big Depino said holding his thumb and forefinger half an inch apart. Whatever it takes to keep the kingdom . Gutierez said the whole world should adopt the Xtravaganzas nonviolent method of resolving territorial disputes. Imagine if instead of shooting and killing each other they all vogued.

Meanwhile theyre starting with the man in the glove hoping that some of their confidence rubs off .

If we cant do it in one week Camacho said we might as well go out of business.

Buffalo News, May 5, 1991

On what she was doing Oscar night hanging out with Michael Jackson:

“We have been working on a song. The question was, will it be a song that’s out on his next album or will it be something we do at some point in the future? Right now, it’s going to be something we do in the future, because I don’t want to make the commitment to it. I’m trying to concentrate on my film career right now. To work with him, I’d have to spend a lot of time in the studio — videos and all that kind of stuff. It’s not what I want to do.”

ST Louis Post, May 9, 1991

IT LOOKS as if Michael Jackson has decided to take Madonna’s advice and completely change his moldy fashion image. Jackson’s representatives have been in touch with several major designers – including Giorgio Armani and Thierry Mugler – and have asked them to submit suggestions about how Jackson might update his sneaker-and-glove wardrobe.

Studio assistant on the Dangerous recording sessions:

–Madonna visited MJ in the studio exactly one time. They spent a little while in his “private” room in the back, and then she left. When I asked Michael later about her visit, he said that she “scared” him.

I think we all speculated that she tried to make a “move” on him, but Michael never said. In any event, we never saw her again after that…

Joe Mantegna, talking about the filming of MJ’s Pepsi Commercial, sometime May 4th -22nd1992

Joe Mantegna who worked on a film with Madonna in 1992 (body of evidence) remembers that Michael was also working on a commercial in a studio nearby. He said that Madonna walked in and Michael was telling him something like, “You know Madonna can be naughty, a bad girl. Sometimes she needs to be spanked.” He hadn’t realized Madonna was standing right behind him.

“Director Joe Pytka tells US she [Madonna] visited him [Michael Jackson] on the set of an ad once: “They hung out for a while. It was a big surprise!”

Dominick Dunne on Larry King Live about this night, December 22, 2004

KING: You also were present when Madonna and Michael Jackson were at the 1991 Oscar party.

DUNNE: You know, that was amazing.

KING: Why?

DUNNE: Because, you know, most of the people at the Lazar party were older folks and so forth, and these two, they were young, gorgeous. And — and he was in uniform, you know.

But Madonna, I’ll never forget her. I mean, it was like what Jean Harlow must have been like back in the ’30s. I mean, the white blonde hair and the silver fox and the diamonds and the thing.

They came in. They were so dazzling. And people like Jimmy Stewart, you know, one of the greats of all time in Hollywood, stood on a chair to get a better look at Madonna and Michael Jackson. I mean, that was the — I mean, they caused such a commotion at that party.

KING: Stars can be affected, then, by other stars?

DUNNE: Absolutely. Absolutely.

KING: So anyone can be star-struck?

DUNNE: I mean, this was the next generation coming along, you see?

KING: Right. Anyone can be star-struck.

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:chuckle:

I thought I would throw in a bit of text talk to help him understand. He's already demonstrated his English isn't very good.

I wasn't laughing at you not him. :lol:

I know, but then it's only my 5th language.

:clap:

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Michael was only known for moonwalking? WTF?

As well as James Brown, Charlie Chaplin, Sammy Davies Jr, Jackie Wilson, Marcel Marceau...

Like other performers, Michael has already stated on many occasions that he was inspired by those people - It's common knowledge.

Michael was always very honest about his inspirations. I always admired that.

Some of these younger pop bitches could learn from that.

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Guest Pud Whacker

The moment that never SHOULD HAVE BEEN: Madonna on MJ's "In The Closet"

thank god. listen, im one of those common folk that when they die, they slowly grow on me like ivy.

but lets face it - BACK THEN when he was alive and she was SHE, it would have been The Worst.

she was and will always be cooler than he could ever be. even post postmortem.

MADONNA LIVES!

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Guest bluejean

The moment that never SHOULD HAVE BEEN: Madonna on MJ's "In The Closet"

thank god. listen, im one of those common folk that when they die, they slowly grow on me like ivy.

but lets face it - BACK THEN when he was alive and she was SHE, it would have been The Worst.

she was and will always be cooler than he could ever be. even post postmortem.

MADONNA LIVES!

I think at that time it would have been doing the obvious. Duetting with Prince was cooler. But the result of that wasn't mind blowing. In The Closet would have been cool imo IF he'd done what Madonna wanted. But that was never going to happen.

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Well, I think you can't compare M's and Michael's "coolness" or other things like that because they were just 2 totally different types of persons, in terms of their work as well as in terms of their private life. But yeah, I'm not sure this would have worked, they really were like plus and minus in every way imaginable, especially back then.

It was probably best for both of them their appearance at the Oscars remained the only form of "collaboration" - that appearance though was amazing, both looked phenomenal together.

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I think at that time it would have been doing the obvious. Duetting with Prince was cooler. But the result of that wasn't mind blowing. In The Closet would have been cool imo IF he'd done what Madonna wanted. But that was never going to happen.

Cool if he had listened to Madonna and dressed up as a woman for the video?

That would've been a huge blow to his career. The media had made out for years that he was slowly morphing into Diana Ross and he was often refered to as a white woman for supposedly bleaching his skin, so could you imagine if he appeared in a video wearing womens clothing? He would have been a laughing stock whereas Madonna would've remained unscathed.

Edited by ThiefOfHearts
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^ Madonna wanted him to dress up like a woman? :huh:

Yes, there's a video floating around somewhere. I'll have a look.

Edited by ThiefOfHearts
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Guest bluejean

What about later in their careers 1999 period or say... if Michael was still alive?

It seems MJ's duets with popular female artists never worked out, he wanted Whitney for I Just Can't Stop Loving You.

I thought he wanted Barabra Streisand?

Anyway. I thought about this and I can't imagine them duetting in the late 90's. Madonna was just too cool at that point. Their styles of music wouldn't have matched. But in the early 90's it could have worked.

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I thought he wanted Barabra Streisand?

Anyway. I thought about this and I can't imagine them duetting in the late 90's. Madonna was just too cool at that point. Their styles of music wouldn't have matched. But in the early 90's it could have worked.

he wanted both, first whitney and then Barbra...

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Why did Whitney say no?

because of the whitening thing? I guess we are used to it now, but backj in the day it was a huge thing

By the way, why a lot of black artist don´t look that black in the pictures?Beyoncé, Prince, Janet...all seem to try to look whiter than they really are

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MJ had vitiligo, a skin disease which destroyed the black pigments. He most likely bleached the remaining parts of his face which were not affected as much, but the reason his skin got light in the first place was the skin disease, which MJ could do nothing against.

I don't think Whitney didn't want to collaborate because of the skin colour controversy, there are lots of pics floating around in the net showing MJ and Whitney meeting together at public events as well as at his Neverland Ranch - they seemed to be on good terms.

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I never swallowed that Vitiligo thing. Precisely from Michael, who spend millions to have the face of a Polish white jew. And after he erased every litle thing from his face that was afroamerican, suddenly he has vitiligo. I'm sorry, but nope.

But don't get angry with me! I'm one of those who thinks that he's one of the best artists ever, because he wrote incredible tracks, had a wonderful voice adn danced like nobody has danced. Look at those Fred Astaire's videos, he took a couple of those ideas and developed them in another level. Just like Madonna did with other ideas that has inspired her.

Those who think that he was overrated i'm sure they are under 30 years old and didn't live properly the period 1985-1991.

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I know the Vitiligo thing is kinda hard to believe, but it was confirmed in the autopsy report. Regardless of whether Michael liked it or not or what he wanted to look like, he did have vitiligo which was the main reason his skin became light. I'm sure the autopsy report doesn't state BS.

He also didn't erase any clue in his face he was black, there are pics floating around from the 90's up to his last years where his make-up wasn't thick and you could clearly see black patches on his skin - portions which weren't affected by the disease. Of course you normally didn't see those, his make-up covered them up - which is understandable. He didn't want to appear in public with parts of his face being white and other parts being black, people would have ripped him to shreds even more.

Michael also constantly made clear that he sees himself as a black person and he's proud of it.

But anyway, there's no need to discuss that any further, autopsy confirmed it, period. He still had lots of weird habits obviously, but the skin bleaching stuff is not true.

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By the way, why a lot of black artist don´t look that black in the pictures?Beyoncé, Prince, Janet...all seem to try to look whiter than they really are

The three Black artist you listed are already light-skinned, but the media/ music industry does make a habit of lightening the complexion of POC. The artists themselves are not trying to appear whiter than they are, it's the industry figures (photographers, editors, PR folks) behind the altered images.

MJ did have issues with his own appearance, but that's a convo for another thread...

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The three Black artist you listed are already light-skinned, but the media/ music industry does make a habit of lightening the complexion of POC. The artists themselves are not trying to appear whiter than they are, it's the industry figures (photographers, editors, PR folks) behind the altered images.

MJ did have issues with his own appearance, but that's a convo for another thread...

if you see images of prince from his

For you album, or whitney´s in her first grammies,or even Janet´s in FAME, they weren´t light skinned

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if you see images of prince from his

For you album, or whitney´s in her first grammies,or even Janet´s in FAME, they weren´t light skinned

Those are studio photographs (in various lighting conditions) your're talking about: melanin can appear a few shades darker or lighter depending on where the picture is taken. And Black people often DO change their complexion over time due to to varying degrees of sun exposure.

Janet & Nippy were tan girls and grew up to be tan women (I'd consider them to be MY skin color, but depending on where I am, I've been considered lightskinned too), but PRINCE has always been as hi-yellow light-bright lightskinned as they come :fag:

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