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The moment that never was: Madonna on MJ's "In The Closet"


TearsInHeaven

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I dont give a shit about his fucking pedophile and neverland ranch behaviour. He's overrated. End of story. That doesn't diminish that he is an ICON and a Legend. He paved the way for POP culture and set the bar high in the 80's. But he's still overrated. And if he didnt pass away, people would still be going after his lack of ability to progress. Thats all

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So terrible and yet he is/was one of the biggest and most successful artists that ever lived. Just because you think he was terribly overrated doesn't make it a fact. I'm SICK AND TIRED of his detractors using that same old boring argument about him "being stuck in 1988", "Not evolving" or bringing up his personal life as an excuse to bash him. Christ, change the fucking record.

i didnt bring up his personal life and when he tried to break out of the Hat and white socks thing...it was terrible. HENCE why he always went back to it
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But he was a tortured soul and with THAT being said, he DID A LOT to try and maintain his status as KING OF POP. And he KEPT that title. No one ever matched him in terms of a legacy for a male artist. He's still overrated :)

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But he was a tortured soul and with THAT being said, he DID A LOT to try and maintain his status as KING OF POP. And he KEPT that title. No one ever matched him in terms of a legacy for a male artist. He's still overrated :)

Elvis more than matched him. I still love Michael Jackson's music though.

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I've personally always found MJ overrated. Thriller is obviously classic. And I like Bad and Dangerous (I actually prefer both to Thriller as albums). But that doesn't mean he wasn't overrated. I mean, he's treated as if he's the greatest living performer ever. But I found his singing, songwriting, and performances to all be overrated. The first two are obviously totally subjective, but let's just take his performances. He literally would just stand there while the crowd cheered and cried. And then he'd do the moonwalk. And lip-sync. 99% of the time. Yes, he was a great dancer. In that department, he was appropriately rated.

And yes, his music did evolve, but to say that his albums were total reinventions or even "very" different is an overstatement. He evolved gradually. And he repeated himself often. That's not always a bad thing. Not everyone needs to be Madonna.

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If someones thinks he's overrated etc. that's totally fine, not everyone has to think positively of him. It's just totally off topic though, there are like 15 posts above me which revolve around that discussion of him being overrated or not. Unnecessary! There's the MJ thread in the General Music discussion to talk about stuff like that. Once again, I think it's ok if some post here and say he's overrated, they don't like his music etc., as we know everyone's entitled to their own opinion, the problem really just is you then have these other people coming in here and starting with his personal life, surgery, drugs BS, a whole new discussion gets kicked off and like most other threads in the past, the topic gets closed down then for all the off-topic posts.

I think we should just focus on what this thread is actually about and what TearsForHeaven intended to discuss, once again there's the MJ thread in the General Music discussion to talk about him specifically (or any other serious artist in that matter).

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I've personally always found MJ overrated. Thriller is obviously classic. And I like Bad and Dangerous (I actually prefer both to Thriller as albums). But that doesn't mean he wasn't overrated. I mean, he's treated as if he's the greatest living performer ever. But I found his singing, songwriting, and performances to all be overrated. The first two are obviously totally subjective, but let's just take his performances. He literally would just stand there while the crowd cheered and cried. And then he'd do the moonwalk. And lip-sync. 99% of the time. Yes, he was a great dancer. In that department, he was appropriately rated.

And yes, his music did evolve, but to say that his albums were total reinventions or even "very" different is an overstatement. He evolved gradually. And he repeated himself often. That's not always a bad thing. Not everyone needs to be Madonna.

agreed. careful though, CRUX (hahaha) will accuse you of having a meltdown. SHUDDERRR
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So terrible and yet he is/was one of the biggest and most successful artists that ever lived. Just because you think he was terribly overrated doesn't make it a fact. I'm SICK AND TIRED of his detractors using that same old boring argument about him "being stuck in 1988", "Not evolving" or bringing up his personal life as an excuse to bash him. Christ, change the fucking record.

Craigle? :huh:

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agreed. careful though, CRUX will accuse you of having a meltdown. SHUDDERRR

Not at all. There's a difference between someone having an opinion : "I've personally always found MJ overrated" and another stating their opinions as fact : "Michael Jackson is just terrible, he's overrated, end of story".

It's a tragedy that you NEED that pointed out to you. *SHUDDERRR*

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For some reason I could never connect when it comes to MJ. I've got all his albums, but I was never a 'fan' if you know what I mean. I honestly prefer those who inspired him (say, Marvin) and those who have been inspired by him (Usher, R. Kelly, Chris Brown etc.) Hell, I'd take Janet over him anyday! He ain't got something as cool as The Pleasure Principle.

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Michael Jackson recycled the same five or six song themes over and over. The same dance moves over and over. The same looks and narrative themes over and over. Many of them came from Fred Astaire.

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Michael Jackson recycled the same five or six song themes over and over. The same dance moves over and over. The same looks and narrative themes over and over. Many of them came from Fred Astaire.

Yeah, and Bob Fosse

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As well as James Brown, Charlie Chaplin, Sammy Davies Jr, Jackie Wilson, Marcel Marceau...

Like other performers, Michael has already stated on many occasions that he was inspired by those people - It's common knowledge.

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Not at all. There's a difference between someone having an opinion : "I've personally always found MJ overrated" and another stating their opinions as fact : "Michael Jackson is just terrible, he's overrated, end of story".

It's a tragedy that you NEED that pointed out to you. *SHUDDERRR*

Djeez isn't it obvious that when someone states something like that on a message board it is in fact an opinion.

Do u expect people 2 post with a disclaimer every time they say something?

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As well as James Brown, Charlie Chaplin, Sammy Davies Jr, Jackie Wilson, Marcel Marceau...

Like other performers, Michael has already stated on many occasions that he was inspired by those people - It's common knowledge.

Yeah, and Bob Fosse

Yep, I'm not suggesting that he was nothing more than a copycat. I think it's great that he took inspiration from other great artists. The main issue with Michaels work is its obviously limited and repetitive nature.

Song about a hot girl who is dangerous.

Song about Michael being bad/invincible etcetera.

Song about saving the world/children.

Song about the media/musical politics making you wanna scream.

Love song.

Did I miss anything?

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Djeez isn't it obvious that when someone states something like that on a message board it is in fact an opinion.

Do u expect people 2 post with a disclaimer every time they say something?

Firstly, I would expect people to refrain from using text talk for a moment before addressing me and secondly I was referring to TRVC, so kindly STFU and get back in your hole.

As expected, I can see this thread will end rather bitterly, so i'll end this here. It seems I can't say anything these days without people being UTTER Cunt's.

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Firstly, I would expect people to refrain from using text talk for a moment before addressing me and secondly I was referring to TRVC, so kindly STFU and get back in your hole.

As expected, I can see this thread will end rather bitterly, so i'll end this here. It seems I can't say anything these days without people being UTTER Cunt's.

:lmao:

Disclaimer diz is my opinion.

MJ waz a bit repetitive N U gotta admit dat. He was known for moonwalking not wot songs were being released.

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:lmao:

Disclaimer diz is my opinion.

MJ waz a bit repetitive N U gotta admit dat. He was known for moonwalking not wot songs were being released.

:chuckle:

I thought I would throw in a bit of text talk to help him understand. He's already demonstrated his English isn't very good.

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Not at all. There's a difference between someone having an opinion : "I've personally always found MJ overrated" and another stating their opinions as fact : "Michael Jackson is just terrible, he's overrated, end of story".

It's a tragedy that you NEED that pointed out to you. *SHUDDERRR*

But this could be said about every statement about everything, even by professional critics. I mean, 90% of the time people pass off their opinions as fact on here (and everywhere else in life). It's because most people have strong convictions. "MJ is overrated" = "I believe MJ Is overrated" because it's coming out of my mouth or fingertips. If someone is nitpicking the fact that someone didn't say "In my opinion" before every statement, that's sort of their own problem, no? Saying someone or something is "overrated" is unprovable. If someone is "overrated" it means that most people value someone or something higher than the person is saying it's overrated. The semantics police on this board are overpaid.

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:chuckle:

I thought I would throw in a bit of text talk to help him understand. He's already demonstrated his English isn't very good.

I know, but then it's only my 5th language.

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Guest bluejean

Firstly, I would expect people to refrain from using text talk for a moment before addressing me and secondly I was referring to TRVC, so kindly STFU and get back in your hole.

As expected, I can see this thread will end rather bitterly, so i'll end this here. It seems I can't say anything these days without people being UTTER Cunt's.

You need to lighten up. This is The acko you're talking to. Hardly a cunt.

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Guest bluejean

:lmao:

Disclaimer diz is my opinion.

MJ waz a bit repetitive N U gotta admit dat. He was known for moonwalking not wot songs were being released.

:rotfl: :rotfl:

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Guest bluejean

Exactly.

Ricky Martin

Britney Spears

Justin Timberlake

Nikki Minaj

Miley Cyrus

ALL well beneath her. The only person she's duetted with on her level I can think of is Prince.

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I think "totally different" is a bit of a stretch. He may have changed things up, but IMO, his albums were always paint by numbers.

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The lyrics are OBVIOUSLY fake. But even if they weren't, one way to know for real that it's just a pisstake is that, if they were real, she would need to be credited on the song because the final lyrics are basically the same, only more tame.

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