100% or don't bother.

[Jazzy Jan]

I love MDNA.

[Barbie]

I agree,the preview sounded much better!

It really did, sounded amazing actually. I don't know what the hell went wrong.

[Genevieve Vavance]

um, what's with the sudden MDNA hate, have a feeling it has something to do with Beyonce's flop album

[Guest Rachelle of London]

um, what's with the sudden MDNA hate, have a feeling it has something to do with Beyonce's flop album

What does Beyoncé have to do with people's opinions on MDNA?

[Guest Not4Pussies]

Yes please no vocoder EVER again.

Trite lyrics are fine as long as she doesn't keep using the same ones over and over, like "moth to a flame" . And sometimes one lazy lyric can ruin a song e.g. In the otherwise-stunning Masterpiece she uses "light" to rhyme with "light". This sort of thing needs her close attention, not just " oh it will do". Oh, and please know when to edit a track. Falling free would have been far more effective if it didn't keep repeating itself toward the end ( though I could say the same about Isaac from COADF).

The tunes are as great as always. The attitude, the concepts..tick. Just more concentration on the vocals/lyrics and avoid overproduction.

Really? Doesn't she sing white and light in Masterpiece or am I hearing wrong

[Guest Rachelle of London]

Really? Doesn't she sing white and light in Masterpiece or am I hearing wrong

You're hearing correctly

[Guest Xanthium]

Sudden MDNA hate? Um, people have been critical of it since day one.

[Guest Rachelle of London]

The only song I dislike on MDNA is Some Girls! Superstar is a great song, I don't get the hate for it

[nick00]

Yes Superstar is a good song, but the track polarizes fans. Some people really hate it.

Even the remix version from Brazil sounded great

[Kurt420]

Just reading through this thread.....I hate to say it, but I think it's time some of you just turn in your Madonna fan card for now....as far as expecting new music you will actually like from her. The "ray of lighters" need to realize that 1998-2002 will never be duplicated again. At this point, HC has been almost 6 years ago, that's over half a decade......if you don't like anything she's done since BEFORE that, I think it's safe to say that you're just not a fan of her new stuff anymore Which is fine, but let's not talk about how we want her to get inspired and that she hasn't been 100% passionate about her work etc because truly, her creative process hasn't changed. Just because someone dislikes something she does, doesn't mean she was less passionate about creating it. The best approach any fan can take toward Madonna is to have no expectations and roll with the punches.

[erotica blu]

Just reading through this thread.....I hate to say it, but I think it's time some of you just turn in your Madonna fan card for now....as far as expecting new music you will actually like from her. The "ray of lighters" need to realize that 1998-2002 will never be duplicated again. At this point, HC has been almost 6 years ago, that's over half a decade......if you don't like anything she's done since BEFORE that, I think it's safe to say that you're just not a fan of her new stuff anymore Which is fine, but let's not talk about how we want her to get inspired and that she hasn't been 100% passionate about her work etc because truly, her creative process hasn't changed. Just because someone dislikes something she does, doesn't mean she was less passionate about creating it. The best approach any fan can take toward Madonna is to have no expectations and roll with the punches.

Madonna created expectations for herself with the public. We expect quality over quantity--MDNA had the most songs released ever for a Madonna project yet the quality wasn't on par with even her less celebrated works: Bedtime Stories, Hard Candy. Madonna is older and I don't expect young, urban, hip, cutting edge music from her but something where you can hear she's at least happy to be in the studio. Her focus was on that damn movie which was rejected the consensus who bothered to see it. Madonna creating an album better than MDNA isn't remotely impossible. I already suggested the easiest path to making a strong and cohesive album. Work with a single producer in their home studio and causally record without a care: Erotica and Confessions were both conceived outside the pressures of renting out professional studio time. Madonna and producer could do as they please without concern for timetable and get on with exploring their ideas when they immediately come.

[Nonoka]

I don't think it's the chart positions or lack of promo which bothers many people about MDNA (although that might have disappointed them too). As I stated some time ago as well, my problem, which might also be the problem of many others, with MDNA is that as an album, it fails. The music's all over the place, it's like a random collection of songs (some amazing, some horribly bad). Same to the looks she spotted and the handling of the album in general. It's all just so chaotic and non-cohesive, something that disappointed me seeing how perfectly executed the release of past M albums as well as the album's theme was.

I know many people interpret everything's all over the place because she wanted it to be that way, that MDNA is a reference to all her past albums, so there's no theme. But that is, after all, just one out of dozen possible interpretations because you really don't know where she was going at with MDNA (the tour, of course, was a totally different thing, but we're solely talking about the album here).

It just feels like it was an accessory for the tour, created while she was busy with other things like her movie, only made to enable her to go on tour. Not like an album she put all her efforts and creativity in, an album full of ideas, which reflects on the music, on the theme, on the looks and the handling of the album. It feels like she was kinda thinking "Oh yeah, I'm gonna record this thing quickly, throw this thing out there and be finished and done with it. I just need this so I can go on tour. My movie's more important anyway". The result was that, while there are a few songs which sound amazing, we've got a lot of songs which sound horribly rushed and uninspired, giving you the impression M only cared to phone in the vocals. I thoroughly believe the Madonna of some years ago would never have bothered to put such songs on an album or be satisfied with those results in the first place.

Once again, I want to point out that it felt that way to me, I'm not saying it was that way, before people start to criticize me for nothing again.

[VogueMusic]

Oh for Christ sake should everyone have the same opinion of everything, surely the whole point of a forum is to discuss matters. I love MDNA but it's not gonna hurt my feelings if another member doesn't.

Very true. I just feel like sometimes it's as if we're just beating a dead horse. We've had the MDNA discussion many times, we've had the HC discussion many times...and it just feels like after a while, we go in circles...and it seems to get more critical when we're in-between projects. And that sometimes, people can state their opinion like it's fact, like XXL said. There's a few Madonna things that aren't my favorites, but I don't turn around saying "oh, it means she didn't give her 100%". That's all.

I would not give a shit if you literally took a shit on MDNA. I still love it either way. What bothers me is the mentality that somehow she doesn't care for the album or making music or that it's "subpar/half-arsed" because she didn't promote it/it flopped/William Orbit says so/someone just doesn't like it so they justify it that way. Like what kind of bullshit is that?

She made the album she wanted to make, and if you don't like it fine, and if you do, that's cool too.

THIS. THIS. THIS.

[5iVe Elements]

The only song I dislike on MDNA is Some Girls! Superstar is a great song, I don't get the hate for it

Yes!!! I even prefer B'Day song than Some Girls. It's not a bad song but it bores me most of the time. Crystal Coffin will get mad at us

[Sphere74]

I just think no matter what some people say, if MDNA had done well on the charts or/and had been praised by critics, a lot more people would have liked it a lot more. It doesn't matter how much some people say ''I don't care about the chart positions,'' deep inside, it DOES matter. She is a commercial artist, therefore her fans expect a commercial success with her products. As simple as that.

And when people forget about MDNA's lack of commercial success in 5, 6 years time, you will see threads like ''appreciate MDNA'' ''MDNA was cutting-edge'' etc etc and people will start saying they like the album.

[erotica blu]

MDNA is Madonna's worst album--subjectively.

[Nonoka]

MDNA is Madonna's worst album--subjectively.

IMO, Erotica is worse in terms of production, True Blue has the silliest non-single songs ever (apart from White Heat) and Hard Candy - while it didn't deserve the beating it initially received - comes across as a Nelly Furtado demo album rather than a Madonna album in some parts. I agree though that MDNA certainly ranks in the lower part of her album list. That doesn't mean it's bad, there's no really bad Madonna album anyway.

[erotica blu]

Erotica is worse in terms of production and True Blue has the silliest non-single songs ever (apart from White Heat), but MDNA certainly ranks in the lower part of her album list.

Kiss my entire ass.

[Nonoka]

Oh sorry, I forgot you're one of these huge Erotica fans. Don't feel offended though, there's nothing wrong with stanning for an album, I totally stan for AL too...

[erotica blu]

Oh sorry, I forgot you're one of these huge Erotica fans. Don't feel offended though, there's nothing wrong with stanning for an album, I totally stan for AL too...

Erotica is in my username. Of course I'll be sensitive to a criticism as significant as the album's production is flawed. It isn't to me.

[Genevieve Vavance]

Erotica is in my username. Of course I'll be sensitive to a criticism as significant as the album's production is flawed. It isn't to me.

erotica is amazing. all of her albums post AL have been a bit subpar imho, but they contain still huge gems imho. don't shoot me! imho

[Guest Not4Pussies]

IMO, Erotica is worse in terms of production, True Blue has the silliest non-single songs ever (apart from White Heat) and Hard Candy - while it didn't deserve the beating it initially received - comes across as a Nelly Furtado demo album rather than a Madonna album in some parts. I agree though that MDNA certainly ranks in the lower part of her album list. That doesn't mean it's bad, there's no really bad Madonna album anyway.

But thats one of the many things it makes Erotica so great is the production. Cold, dark, raw and rough. Very 90s. The production on MDNA is all over the place. I mean albums that came out 10 years ago sound better and louder than MDNA. Hell AL is better produced and that came out in 03.

[drunkbysix]

How can an album be phoned in or lazy when it at least has personal songs on if????

[erotica blu]

How can an album be phoned in or lazy when it at least has personal songs on if????

Madonna's older. She can't fake how she feels about things in her personal life. That doesn't mean she cared so much about production or the final mix and master.

[Kurt420]

I just think no matter what some people say, if MDNA had done well on the charts or/and had been praised by critics, a lot more people would have liked it a lot more. It doesn't matter how much some people say ''I don't care about the chart positions,'' deep inside, it DOES matter. She is a commercial artist, therefore her fans expect a commercial success with her products. As simple as that.

And when people forget about MDNA's lack of commercial success in 5, 6 years time, you will see threads like ''appreciate MDNA'' ''MDNA was cutting-edge'' etc etc and people will start saying they like the album.

Agree. I don't care what some of these people say. I have ZERO doubt in my mind had it sold more or produced a hit single or two that the perception would be different. In fact, before and right at release many were calling it her best since ROL. Even our very own forum scrooge GSM claimed as such (if memory serves me right......granted I HIGHLY doubt he'd say that now).....feel free to look it up if you want.

Also, I can remember before HU really took off, many were saying she was desperate, dry of ideas (recycling her own lyrics and using an ABBA beat) and copying Gwen Stefani with the whole "clock theme". Cut to a couple months later when COADF was atop all the charts in the world, selling 7 million copies and HU was number one in a gazillion countries and it was one of the best albums of her career, she was back in true form etc etc etc. I'm sorry, but if that album had flopped people would label it as Euro cheese......I say that and COADF IS one of my faves by her but I'm just being realistic.

[Guest Xanthium]

I don't think it's the chart positions or lack of promo which bothers many people about MDNA (although that might have disappointed them too). As I stated some time ago as well, my problem, which might also be the problem of many others, with MDNA is that as an album, it fails. The music's all over the place, it's like a random collection of songs (some amazing, some horribly bad). Same to the looks she spotted and the handling of the album in general. It's all just so chaotic and non-cohesive, something that disappointed me seeing how perfectly executed the release of past M albums as well as the album's theme was.

I know many people interpret everything's all over the place because she wanted it to be that way, that MDNA is a reference to all her past albums, so there's no theme. But that is, after all, just one out of dozen possible interpretations because you really don't know where she was going at with MDNA (the tour, of course, was a totally different thing, but we're solely talking about the album here).

It just feels like it was an accessory for the tour, created while she was busy with other things like her movie, only made to enable her to go on tour. Not like an album she put all her efforts and creativity in, an album full of ideas, which reflects on the music, on the theme, on the looks and the handling of the album. It feels like she was kinda thinking "Oh yeah, I'm gonna record this thing quickly, throw this thing out there and be finished and done with it. I just need this so I can go on tour. My movie's more important anyway". The result was that, while there are a few songs which sound amazing, we've got a lot of songs which sound horribly rushed and uninspired, giving you the impression M only cared to phone in the vocals. I thoroughly believe the Madonna of some years ago would never have bothered to put such songs on an album or be satisfied with those results in the first place.

Once again, I want to point out that it felt that way to me, I'm not saying it was that way, before people start to criticize me for nothing again.

Interesting points. Kinda agree with some stuff. The album does feel a bit rushed like her mind wasn't on it 100%. Still think her heart was in the film at the time and she was feeling a bit stretched thin with trying to make all her deadlines. I do feel like the album flows really well though. It only gets jarring to me when Masterpiece kicks in. Overall, I really enjoy the album because in the past two years I've listened to the living shit out of it. Even when Madonna is not at her best, she sucks me in. Her music really is the soundtrack to my life.

[Guest Xanthium]

Very true. I just feel like sometimes it's as if we're just beating a dead horse. We've had the MDNA discussion many times, we've had the HC discussion many times...and it just feels like after a while, we go in circles...and it seems to get more critical when we're in-between projects. And that sometimes, people can state their opinion like it's fact, like XXL said. There's a few Madonna things that aren't my favorites, but I don't turn around saying "oh, it means she didn't give her 100%". That's all.

I see what you're saying but as a Madonna forum we're gonna discuss things ad nauseam. That's the nature of the beast. Besides, it's fun to come back to old topics to get a different perspective on them. I'm always incorporating new ideas and readjusting my opinions accordingly. And while we can only speculate that Madonna did or did not give 100%, no one can say for certainty either way.

[XXL]

Agree. I don't care what some of these people say. I have ZERO doubt in my mind had it sold more or produced a hit single or two that the perception would be different. In fact, before and right at release many were calling it her best since ROL. Even our very own forum scrooge GSM claimed as such (if memory serves me right......granted I HIGHLY doubt he'd say that now).....feel free to look it up if you want.

Also, I can remember before HU really took off, many were saying she was desperate, dry of ideas (recycling her own lyrics and using an ABBA beat) and copying Gwen Stefani with the whole "clock theme". Cut to a couple months later when COADF was atop all the charts in the world, selling 7 million copies and HU was number one in a gazillion countries and it was one of the best albums of her career, she was back in true form etc etc etc. I'm sorry, but if that album had flopped people would label it as Euro cheese......I say that and COADF IS one of my faves by her but I'm just being realistic.

[LSD]

Agree. I don't care what some of these people say. I have ZERO doubt in my mind had it sold more or produced a hit single or two that the perception would be different. In fact, before and right at release many were calling it her best since ROL. Even our very own forum scrooge GSM claimed as such (if memory serves me right......granted I HIGHLY doubt he'd say that now).....feel free to look it up if you want.

Also, I can remember before HU really took off, many were saying she was desperate, dry of ideas (recycling her own lyrics and using an ABBA beat) and copying Gwen Stefani with the whole "clock theme". Cut to a couple months later when COADF was atop all the charts in the world, selling 7 million copies and HU was number one in a gazillion countries and it was one of the best albums of her career, she was back in true form etc etc etc. I'm sorry, but if that album had flopped people would label it as Euro cheese......I say that and COADF IS one of my faves by her but I'm just being realistic.

I agree with every word

[Nonoka]

But thats one of the many things it makes Erotica so great is the production. Cold, dark, raw and rough. Very 90s. The production on MDNA is all over the place. I mean albums that came out 10 years ago sound better and louder than MDNA. Hell AL is better produced and that came out in 03.

Well, first of all - just for your own knowledge - if you write about an album sounding better and louder than another, you actually mean the mastering of the album, not the production

Sound quality depends on the mastering. And in that matter, an album sounding loud often is a sign of inferior mastering. The more the loudness gets increased, the more the dynamic range gets reduced - and thus the sound quality after a certain point as well. I suggest you to read up a bit about the loudness war.

No way AL has a better mastering than MDNA - it's actually a perfect example of that loudness war. Songs are WAY too loud mastered, you can even hear distortion in Love Profusion and I'm So Stupid. MDNA isn't exactly a masterpiece in terms of sound quality either, but at least it isn't that plagued by loudness and distortion like AL is.