MDNA Promo Discussion - "non-traditional campaign"?

[Apples388]

The Madonna brand has already been tarnished though. The positive reviews for the album have drowned in a sea of negative publicity. Take your pick from -

* Huge 2nd week drop for the album worldwide

* Number 37 peak for GMAYL in the UK

* "Have you seen Molly?" trying to be down with the kids and failing scandal

* GGW flopping in the USA

* This constant Piers Morgan banning Madonna from his show shit (I know it means nothing but it's constant negative publicity)

* "Reductive"-gate (it was all amusing in the start but when the dust has settled, it just seemed a bit unnecessary and beneath her)

Even the amazing Superbowl performance is now tainted a bit with that stupid MIA middle-finger thing which is mentioned in every single write-up.

And negative publicity in the "coming soon" section:

* Slow ticket sales for the tour

* Backtracking on giving promotional interviews

* Truth or Dare smells like grandma!

* Madonna toilet paper

And so on and so forth

[Guest Coked Up Baby Boy]

I seem to be the only person here who really doesn't give a fuck about promo for this album we had the Superbowl, she spoke to Jimmy Phallus, 2 good music videos and the album is great too. Why would her on a magazine cover light up our lives all of a sudden?

I dunno, maybe it's because she was everywhere only a few months earlier doing W.E. promo that i feel like i've seen a lot of her lately and it doesn't bother me that she isn't cracking middle aged housewife jokes on Ellen.

[Guest jamesshot]

I seem to be the only person here who really doesn't give a fuck about promo for this album we had the Superbowl, she spoke to Jimmy Phallus, 2 good music videos and the album is great too. Why would her on a magazine cover light up our lives all of a sudden?

I dunno, maybe it's because she was everywhere only a few months earlier doing W.E. promo that i feel like i've seen a lot of her lately and it doesn't bother me that she isn't cracking middle aged housewife jokes on Ellen.

I think it is really just because the negative publicity is so overwhelming for this really trivial 2nd week drop that is has completely overshadowed everything. Trivial because she is doing zero promo and has no hit song so it isn't shocking at all that it fell so sharply. Had she done promo and it still fell 88% that is the time to worry...BUT... Roger Friedman really fucked her up a bit this time.

[Guest Coked Up Baby Boy]

Meh, negative second week buzz, Gaga had it too and BTD still sold 7 million copies world wide and her tour is selling fine . I'm sure these journalists will be writing about Madonnas HUGE success of a show a year from now and how the album sold a good 2-2.5 million copies or some shit.

I think the fact is, there were no huge singles off this album, Madonna is 53, and it's just not 1998 anymore dolls. Doing talk shows every week really wasn't going to shift singles or albums. This album was KNOWN to be released, people who cared enough bought it, others didn't, that's it really.

Everyone needs to stop fixating on the current state of things and look at it all from a bigger picture, which is a picture we'll have once this whole era is actually done.

[Apples388]

I think the fact is, there were no huge singles off this album, Madonna is 53, and it's just not 1998 anymore dolls. Doing talk shows every week really wasn't going to shift singles or albums. This album was KNOWN to be released, people who cared enough bought it, others didn't, that's it really.

It's not 1998 but is it also not 2005/2006 either?

Traditional promotion still works - that's why the majority of other artists do it. It was even mentioned in the BB200 write-up when she went in at No. 1 (Lionel Richie was whoring his azz on the promo circuit).

A lot of casual fans and the public did not know the album was out because of 2 reasons:

1. The lack of a big hit

2. The lack of promotion

End of.

[Guest jamesshot]

Meh, negative second week buzz, Gaga had it too and BTD still sold 7 million copies world wide and her tour is selling fine . I'm sure these journalists will be writing about Madonnas HUGE success of a show a year from now and how the album sold a good 2-2.5 million copies or some shit.

I think the fact is, there were no huge singles off this album, Madonna is 53, and it's just not 1998 anymore dolls. Doing talk shows every week really wasn't going to shift singles or albums. This album was KNOWN to be released, people who cared enough bought it, others didn't, that's it really.

Everyone needs to stop fixating on the current state of things and look at it all from a bigger picture, which is a picture we'll have once this whole era is actually done.

I disagree. Gaga is a media darling so they tend to gloss over whatever underperformance she does. She got completely demolished by Adele, Katy, Rihanna, Taylor in every way yet the media writes about her like she is the #1 female atm when she may not even be top 5.

With Madonna, they smell blood and they will try to portray this tour as a flop ( and many here already have started the job for them). Doing certain kinds of promo absolutely does work...look no further than Lionel Richie or Bruce Springsteen as recent examples. Adele wouldn't still be selling loads of CD's had it not been for some luck and some well timed promo ( performances, 60 Minutes ) which propelled her slowly sinking CD into the stratosphere yet again. Doing Letterman isn't going to do much esp if she doesn't perform. But there are things she could do that will propel MDNA along and stop the bleeding.

[Guest Coked Up Baby Boy]

It's not 1998 but is it also not 2005/2006 either?

Traditional promotion still works - that's why the majority of other artists do it. It was even mentioned in the BB200 write-up when she went in at No. 1 (Lionel Richie was whoring his azz on the promo circuit).

A lot of casual fans and the public did not know the album was out because of 2 reasons:

1. The lack of a big hit

2. The lack of promotion

End of.

I just don't believe it, sorry. The genenral public are aware of A LOT of random shit as consumers. Anyone who watched the news, or picked up a magazine saw SOMETHING about her new album or Superbowl or her Nicki collab or SOMETHING. My 65 year old Father who isn't aware of ANYTHING knew she had a new single out

She's old, she can't shift things like she used to anymore, it's just the way shit goes down in the pop world. I'm sure more aggressive promo would have only made her first week sales a bit higher and her second week still would have been a huge drop.

[Apples388]

I just don't believe it, sorry. The genenral public are aware of A LOT of random shit as consumers. Anyone who watched the news, or picked up a magazine saw SOMETHING about her new album or Superbowl or her Nicki collab or SOMETHING. My 65 year old Father who isn't aware of ANYTHING knew she had a new single out

She's old, she can't shift things like she used to anymore, it's just the way shit goes down in the pop world. I'm sure more aggressive promo would have only made her first week sales a bit higher and her second week still would have been a huge drop.

All of this would have been irrelevant if the first single was a hit though. And it wasn't because GMAYL was shit.

[Ai Papi Si.]

We're doing an awful lot of worrying for people who aren't on Madonna's payroll

Guy is aware of how bad this looks, if he's smart he will try to do something about it before she officially launches the tour. If he doesn't, oh well. Let's hope the tour renders all of this irrelevant.

[markm]

All of this would have been irrelevant if the first single was a hit though. And it wasn't because GMAYL was shit.

Give Me All Your Bucket sealed the album's fate from the minute it leaked. I still find it difficult to believe how anyone

who knows anything about the music business thought it was a good idea for it to be the first single. Worst decision ever. Once the lead single

flops the album is pretty much done for.

[Guest Coked Up Baby Boy]

I disagree. Gaga is a media darling so they tend to gloss over whatever underperformance she does. She got completely demolished by Adele, Katy, Rihanna, Taylor in every way yet the media writes about her like she is the #1 female atm when she may not even be top 5.

With Madonna, they smell blood and they will try to portray this tour as a flop ( and many here already have started the job for them). Doing certain kinds of promo absolutely does work...look no further than Lionel Richie or Bruce Springsteen as recent examples. Adele wouldn't still be selling loads of CD's had it not been for some luck and some well timed promo ( performances, 60 Minutes ) which propelled her slowly sinking CD into the stratosphere yet again. Doing Letterman isn't going to do much esp if she doesn't perform. But there are things she could do that will propel MDNA along and stop the bleeding.

You can't compare Madonna to Lional and Bruce, women have it different in the media, especially in the pop world, she's never going to have the same pull as them. Also, Lional and Bruce make music for "adults", all that AC radio shit. Old men and women are gonna buy it, who's buying Madonna? a lot of 50 year olds aren't interested in music like Gang Bang and I'm Addicted, and she's too old for the kiddies to care either. Her market has gotten smaller as she's aged, it was only a matter of time before that started to REALLY show, and with this album, it has.

It started with HC tbh, the only difference was, that era had a GOOD lead single, which gave her a massive hit. This era had a SHIT lead single, so there was no big LAUNCH musically this era, and before some Bucket loon comes in here all "it wasn't shit!", it was, it wasn't a favourite, it flopped, and you fucking know it, so sit the fuck down already. The start of the era because of that single all just kinda plodded along. If she didn't have the Superbowl, this era would seem like it NEVER took off at all

Anyway, whatevs, we can sit here and "coulda, woulda, shoulda" all day, but it's done, the singles were poor choices, she didn't do a huge promo campaign and now she has a lapse in album sales, what can you do? all we can do is go to her show, which people will do by the millions, as per usual. That's her market, that's her strong hold on the music industry now that she is a "Legends" act. Take it and roll with it, save the 3 months top 5 albums sales for Rihanna and Adele or something.

[loomer]

Oh yes, needs to be :cubb: his trademark smilie. Another for the list!

[Apples388]

let's hope the tour renders all of this irrelevant.

It won't though. The tour is a separate animal from the record - they are not tied together. LiveNation and Guy O are pushing to tie it all up together because of her 360 deal (which necessitates that) but in reality the music landscape has not really changed that much.

If Guy O thinks that the album will shoot straight back into the UK or US top 10 when she plays those respective countries on tour (hence his initial arrogant comments) then he's in for a harsh wake-up call.

[markm]

This era had a SHIT lead single, so there was no big LAUNCH musically this era, and before some Bucket loon comes in here all "it wasn't shit!", it was, it wasn't a favourite, it flopped, and you fucking know it, so sit the fuck down already. The start of the era because of that single all just kinda plodded along. If she didn't have the Superbowl, this era would seem like it NEVER took off at all

[loomer]

Give Me All Your Bucket sealed the album's fate from the minute it leaked. I still find it difficult to believe how anyone

who knows anything about the music business thought it was a good idea for it to be the first single. Worst decision ever. Once the lead single

flops the album is pretty much done for.

Hardly the only example though

[Ai Papi Si.]

Meanwhile is she really having trouble selling tickets in certain markets? I just find this so hard to believe. If anything I thought the tour would be doing premiumly considering it's been awhile. Did Sticky & Suite have any similar issues with sales? I seem to remember talk of that, which all got put to rest when the tour sold out anyway.

[markm]

There is a rumour on another site that the London show will be broadcast live on tv and on big screens around the city. Now that would be

a good idea.)

[Apples388]

Meanwhile is she really having trouble selling tickets in certain markets? I just find this so hard to believe. If anything I thought the tour would be doing premiumly considering it's been awhile. Did Sticky & Suite have any similar issues with sales? I seem to remember talk of that, which all got put to rest when the tour sold out anyway.

Go on Ticketmaster UK or some of the European ones and you will be able to pull tickets (and not necessarily nosebleed ones.)

Having said that, this tour will mainly sell out too. But a lot of the "sold out" propaganda is just that: propaganda.

Multiple shows are always planned in advance (venues are aware); venues are downscaled in order to have "sold out" reports etc. For instance, the Abu Dhabi concerts. They downscaled the venue to ensure she sells out the first night for good publicity so they can push out a 2nd night (which still has not sold out.) And so on and so forth.

[Mat.Guy]

Suedehead is the only one that makes sense here. I agree with you 100%.

[Guest jamesshot]

Meanwhile is she really having trouble selling tickets in certain markets? I just find this so hard to believe. If anything I thought the tour would be doing premiumly considering it's been awhile. Did Sticky & Suite have any similar issues with sales? I seem to remember talk of that, which all got put to rest when the tour sold out anyway.

I thought it was doing well too but then I started reading this thread and it was doomsday raining down on MDNA tour. I'm confused...there is so much hysteria ( some justified, most not) it is hard to tell what to believe.

[Apples388]

There is a rumour on another site that the London show will be broadcast live on tv and on big screens around the city. Now that would be

a good idea.)

OH MY GOD PLEASE YES

Now this is "non-traditional" promo that I can live with. Not "free MDNA copy with Andrex loo roll".

And FYI Guy O, that is not "non-traditional" at all! Good ol' Freddy deMann ensured the Blonde Ambition Tour had multiple broadcasts and we all know that tour for the legendary iconictastications event that it was even to this day.

[Guest Coked Up Baby Boy]

Praying for some of you in here. The next 10 years of singles/sales are gonna be hard on you guys with your application of promo techniques for 20 year old popstars being applied to a 53 year old woman.

Oh well. Bless you all.

[Guest jamesshot]

Go on Ticketmaster UK or some of the European ones and you will be able to pull tickets (and not necessarily nosebleed ones.)

Having said that, this tour will mainly sell out too. But a lot of the "sold out" propaganda is just that: propaganda.

Multiple shows are always planned in advance (venues are aware); venues are downscaled in order to have "sold out" reports etc. For instance, the Abu Dhabi concerts. They downscaled the venue to ensure she sells out the first night for good publicity so they can push out a 2nd night (which still has not sold out.) And so on and so forth.

True but also I have heard that, say, Madonna puts up 30,000 tix for sale at a venue they scaled down from 50,000. She sells better than they originally thought so they put more tix for sale and she ends up selling all 50,000. However, Boxscore will only report the 30,000 originally put on sale. From SST, many stops reported to have had way bigger crowds than what was officially reported due to what I described happening. I think for CT, Moscow was said to only have had some low number in attendance but everyone there ( and Youtube videos) said the crowd was easily larger than what was reported. Heard the same thing for many of the open air stops like Estonia, Finland and Poland.

[Guest]

I think we should all take a HUGE chill pill. This is a woman who has endured negative press coverage since her career began! She survived 12 months of relentless negative media attention throughout the Erotica/Sex fiasco,(to name but 1 occassion) Madonna is always getting it in the neck,they knock her down and she gets back up!! Even if this is the beginning of the end of her ability to sell albums/concert tickets,she's MADONNA for fucks sake,and no MOTHERFUCKER ( I'm talking to you GAGA) can ever or will ever come close to achieving what M has!!

[Guest jamesshot]

Praying for some of you in here. The next 10 years of singles/sales are gonna be hard on you guys with your application of promo techniques for 20 year old popstars being applied to a 53 year old woman.

Oh well. Bless you all.

I think that is a good point...she actually IS selling more than many 20 year old pop stars ( hasn't she already outsold Rihanna's new CD??) and she is about to overtake Drake for #3 for the year. She is capable of outselling anyone worldwide ( maybe not Adele but almost everyone). No, Madonna can't promote exactly like Richie or Springsteen but she can do something other than what she has. I think she has done fantastic with no promo at all. 400,000 in 2 weeks is stunning but it is being turned into a negative at warp speed which is the real point to much of this hysteria ( I think).

[Apples388]

Praying for some of you in here. The next 10 years of singles/sales are gonna be hard on you guys with your application of promo techniques for 20 year old popstars being applied to a 53 year old woman.

Oh well. Bless you all.

She could apply the promo techniques of a 47-year-old though. Remember Confessions on a Dance Floor? Oh yes, only her biggest selling album since Ray of Light. Massive first single + lots of promo + fantastic tour = maximisation of album sales.

I don't see a huge difference between 47 and 53 but maybe that's just me!

Just because she's on a 360 deal and is a few years older does not mean that a shitty first single, ALDO shoes, perfumes or films about Wallace Simpson will sell her music.

Maybe the MDNA Tour with a massive banner saying that "she broke her own record for biggest tour by a solo artist ever" will sell the album; but maybe it won't. It's a gamble that Guy O is taking and personally I don't think it is going to work. But let's wait and see him in a year's time, shall we.

[Guest Coked Up Baby Boy]

She could apply the promo techniques of a 47-year-old though. Remember Confessions on a Dance Floor? Oh yes, only her biggest selling album since Ray of Light.

I don't see a huge difference between 47 and 53 but maybe that's just me!

Well clearly there is a difference as this era shows.

In an industry that moves faster than a cock cumming, between records is like a lifetime. 6 years is a while imo. A woman in her 40's and a woman in her 50's are actually different.

Confessions had a MASSIVE lead single due to it being a great crowd pleaser of a track and Madonna being "hot" again after the flop of AL. No one cared about her during AL, the public weren't interested. COADF benefited from that.

Confessions and MDNA are two different animals as far as why and how it all unfolded. I wouldn't compare them.

[Dannylex]

Praying for some of you in here. The next 10 years of singles/sales are gonna be hard on you guys with your application of promo techniques for 20 year old popstars being applied to a 53 year old woman.

Oh well. Bless you all.

+1

[Apples388]

I'm not comparing the albums - merely the promotional strategies.

And also, you can compare the AL/COADF scenario to HC/MDNA - she was "hot" again in the beginning of this era. It's just that GMAYL was just so... shit.

But I just don't think the music climate has changed all that much since COADF, apart from a bigger presence of iTunes really. The major new presence in her area if you will has been the rise of Lady Gaga - which she clearly noticed, hence the "reductive" comment- which really was unncessary at the end of the day and just smacked of the 1995 Mariah Carey comments which clearly stemmed from jealousy.

Plus, the fact that she is now going to be doing interviews just speaks volumes. She has already proven my point. This entire promo strategy for the era has been a big cock-up.

[Guest jamesshot]

She could apply the promo techniques of a 47-year-old though. Remember Confessions on a Dance Floor? Oh yes, only her biggest selling album since Ray of Light. Massive first single + lots of promo + fantastic tour = maximisation of album sales.

I don't see a huge difference between 47 and 53 but maybe that's just me!

Just because she's on a 360 deal and is a few years older does not mean that a shitty first single, ALDO shoes, perfumes or films about Wallace Simpson will sell her music.

Maybe the MDNA Tour with a massive banner saying that "she broke her own record for biggest tour by a solo artist ever" will sell the album; but maybe it won't. It's a gamble that Guy O is taking and personally I don't think it is going to work. But let's wait and see him in a year's time, shall we.

Thank you! I was just going to say what you said so wonderfully. Madonna wasn't supposed to do what she did with Ray of Light. Madonna wasn't supposed to do what she did with Music. Madonna wasn't supposed to do what she did with COADF. Madonna wasn't supposed to do what she did with 4M. Madonna wasn't supposed to do, Madonna wasn't supposed to do is all it has been for...ever. Why? AGE AGE AGE. Sometimes her own fans don't realize THE RULES DONT APPLY TO MADONNA FOR A REASON. It's why SHES MADONNA and THE REST are THE REST. So, because she is 53 and the odds are stacked against her she or we shouldn't expect or want her to continue to bust the fuck out of that ceiling everyone keeps insisting on placing above her? How many times is she going to have to bust it until people realize the rules don't apply to Madonna for a reason. It is really in her control and I have faith that if she wants it, she'll get it whatever it is be it a smash hit or platinum CD.